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CrimLaw Bros: Victim doesn't want to press charges. . .
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Date: June 25th, 2012 4:46 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Often when I'm dealing with a Domestic violence case the victim in the matter will either come to court or call my office and say:
"Well. . .me and him had gotten into an argument, and we started fighting and. . .I don't wanna press charges no more."
or
"Well, he said he was gonna get some counseling for his drinking/drug and we are working on our problems, so I don't wanna press charges no more."
Whatever the variation, they typically don't want to see their husband/boyfriend/baby-daddy get in trouble despite the fact that they beat the shit out of them (repeatedily).
I typically don't dismiss the charges and still go forward as long as I have solid evidence that violence did take place. Mostly because I feel like the SOMEONE how to stand up to the Def. and show him (sometimes her) that she can't put their hands on whomever they want and then just butter them up later on.
Those of ya'll who had dealt with this, what's your take? |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 4:50 PM Author: Chocolate irradiated office I'd say evaluate stuff on a case by case basis with a bit of lenience for first timers absent real physical injury
obviously it's a bad idea to let the repeated beaters off
but how do you deal with having a shit witness? just go with the police report? |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 4:54 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Problem with that is this may be the first time the victim has reported it.
I feel that there is a difference between:
"We got into an argument and he pushed me."
vs.
"We got into an argument and he punched me in the nose and dragged me across the floor."
The former is somewhat understandable in the heat of the moment. The ladder shows a violent nature and willinginess to seriously hurt their supposed loved one. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:10 PM Author: effete space national security agency I see these cases all the time and the cases of real injury or anything beyond a very quick incident are quite rare. Usually it's not even clear who hit who first, except to the arresting officer, of course. If someone's collar gets stretched, it's FV Battery. If a lamp gets knocked over, trespass to property. If kids are in the house, child endangerment or some shit like that. And if D is on probation, the gf can have made it all up with no evidence whatsoever and his ass will be back in jail. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20956950) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:12 PM Author: Chocolate irradiated office problem is without serious injury all you know is there was a fight and the bitch got pissed enough to call it in
a broken nose or the like would count as real physical injury obviously, but just her saying, then recanting, that he dragged her ass around isn't much |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:36 PM Author: Autistic dilemma legend Using a ladder in a fight is pretty fucked up. They been watching too much wrasslin (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957110) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:43 PM Author: Excitant abode ty (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957146) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:50 PM Author: Pearly wild nibblets underrated (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957187) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 10:14 PM Author: Dashing harsh house factory reset button (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957832) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:09 PM Author: Puce flatulent corn cake weed whacker (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958423) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:46 PM Author: Henna marvelous national alpha (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958879) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:43 AM Author: azure beady-eyed useless brakes eagle eyes! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959449) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:46 AM Author: Soul-stirring Wine Forum Selfie (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959470) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:52 AM Author: fluffy casino ty brother. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959537) |
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Date: July 3rd, 2017 8:50 PM Author: Vivacious Sienna Theater (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#33698444) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:15 PM Author: Glassy Zippy Reading Party Antidepressant Drug What size market are you a prosecutor in? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957003) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 9:59 PM Author: Deranged blue indian lodge gunner Absolutely the right thing to do. Hard as hell and you will lose a ton of cases, but fuck those assholes. They need the foot of justice up their ass. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957673) |
Date: June 25th, 2012 8:11 PM Author: Light cracking macaca mother Prosecutors are uptight knuckle-dragging shit-sniffing braindead scum of the earth. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20956972) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:13 PM Author: Bateful masturbator trailer park you have to keep in mind that a lot of women make shit up just to get their boyfriends arrested, then "decline to press charges" so that they won't have to commit perjury later on. there is also a huge problem with false/made-up rape accusations.
women are manipulative like that. some of them will even hit themselves in the face or bruise themselves to create a false impression of abuse. you need a keen eye for these things in order to avoid persecuting innocent men. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:55 PM Author: Rambunctious twinkling potus site (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958982) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:15 PM Author: curious lavender famous landscape painting odds are they're both trashy proles and deserve each other. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957002) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:16 PM Author: cobalt striped hyena location if you have cause to charge, you can probably get a do not contact order issued at the arraignment anyway, if you're a real crusader who is concerned with keeping dude away from her, there you go.
of course, they will both disregard it, and then you charge the dude with violating the order.
churn n burn bro |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:17 PM Author: Chocolate irradiated office if the victim doesn't even want to press charges it shouldn't be hard at all for the dood to get the conditions of bail modified (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957014) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:20 PM Author: cobalt striped hyena location unless he victim is in the courtroom and screams that she doesn't want the order, the judge will almost always issue it. No judge wants to be the one who neglected to issue a no contact order and then the guy makes bail and goes back and kills the girl.
even if the girl is there and says she doesn't want it issued, if the complaint is harshly worded enough the judge will tell the victim to buzz off and issue it anyway. Again, no judge wants to be the one that let "that guy" off, and with the limited information they have, they'll err on the side of caution. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:22 PM Author: Chocolate irradiated office that's why you file the motion to modify after the order is granted (since it will be) and the victim comes in and is all like "there wasn't any actual violence, he poses no threat, this is a misunderstanding and I need him at home to do xyz"
judges aren't going to ignore this unless it was some brutal stuff |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 10:37 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Uh. . .no.
I've had the situtations where Judge will set a high bond. Def. can't post bond. Atty files a motion, Judge denies it because of the violent act the Def. committed.
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:44 AM Author: Chocolate irradiated office Cases where the alleged victim comes in and asks for modification and denies any violence occurred? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959458) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:47 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Depends on the evidence.
If the victim denies violence took place, but I have an arrest warrant taken out by an officer in addition to photographic evidence, the victim recanting her/his testimony really won't move the judge at all.
No judge wants to be on the 10:00 news because a defendant they gave an OR bond to went out and killed their baby-momma.
Judge: Well. . .the victim came to court and said that nothing had happened. . .I believed her.
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:21 PM Author: arousing set often the person the stay order is in favor of has to appear to request modification or elimination of the order. So if she's not even on board enough to come to court, it can just linger (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957033) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:23 PM Author: Chocolate irradiated office if she doesn't want to press charges it isn't because of the trouble of going to court dood (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957041) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:24 PM Author: arousing set i dont mean that. I mean often the alleged victims are too ghetto, too indifferent, or too cracked out or whatever, even to bother to come to court. or they are just dealing with lots of emotional shit and dont come in. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957045) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:26 PM Author: Chocolate irradiated office in that case she doesn't "not want to press charges" she just isn't cooperating (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957059) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:27 PM Author: arousing set tomato, tomato (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957060) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:27 PM Author: Chocolate irradiated office you have to leave some way to describe a "victim" that is actually interested in having the dood come home, which describe a fucking lot of them (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957066) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:18 PM Author: arousing set If I were a prosecutor, Id just do 911 tape and excited utterance, bro. Don't even need her there.
Thank God, Im not, and I realize that of all crimes on the face of the earth, "domestic violence" crimes are the most suspect.
What happens in the house should stay in the house, 99% of the time. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 10:02 PM Author: Deranged blue indian lodge gunner Crawford yo. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957701) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 10:06 PM Author: arousing set Ongoing emerg, non testimonial. Davis (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957741) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 10:12 PM Author: Deranged blue indian lodge gunner Bryant as well. But judges tend to say that unless the dude is hitting her on the 911 then testimonial. Trying DV cases sucks. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957808) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:18 PM Author: Green Den how do you have enough evidence in domestic violence cases to proceed with the charges with no victim or other witnesses? seems nearly impossible. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957020) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:20 PM Author: arousing set With a cop and an authenticated 911 call, they can meet the burden. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957030) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 10:54 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm - Arresting officer
- 911 phone call
- 911 Dispatcher that took the call
- Photographic evidence
- Subpoena the victim so she has to take the stand (unless they're married).
Most domestic cases plead out. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:19 PM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams How is the 911 good for anything but self serving illegal bolstering? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958550) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:35 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm lolwut? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959367) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:32 PM Author: Swollen Slate Sex Offender i gotta ? for you solaw: my buddy called me and told me the cops brought him in for questioning becaues he was making out/back massaging some chick and 3 days later she randomly reported him to the police for assault (even though she gave no indication at all she was not consenting). chances you would proceed with the investigation? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20957087) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:01 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Need to hear interviews of both victim and defendant. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958301) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:02 PM Author: Swollen Slate Sex Offender the "victim" is a flighty dumb bitch whose own roommates don't believe her
my bro is honest to a fault, perhaps gets a little too forward with women occasionally but not bad |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:08 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Says you, a partial witness.
I never believe a word the Def. or his mother says whenever they talk about how "good" the person is.
Instead I'd need to look at the evidence in the case before I made a decision.
If it goes to trial, it'll be the evidence that I'll have to rely upon to meet my burden, because other women REGULARLY distrust female victims in non-stranger sexual assault cases. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 8:49 PM Author: Pearly wild nibblets they committed a crime against the people, not only the victim
charge that mother fucker |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:06 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Here is why I usually go forward even with an uncooperative witness.
This isn't usually the first time that the Defendant has hit the victim.
The victim has million different reasons for not stopping the fighting:
- psychological
- financial
- "cuz she luh him"
or whatever. The Defendant takes advantage of that and realizes that he/she can do whatever they want against the victim as long as they "apologize" to them before it goes to trial and thus they start all over again.
At least if I go forward then the Defendant will know that if he/she puts their hands on the victim again, they will have to deal with the Courts and they won't be able to just have the victim "forget about it".
I dunno, I just hate Domestic Violence cases, so I'm a hardass about it. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:18 PM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams When you press forward with bad cases and lose, you undermine the respect for the law in the future. They will be less likely to call the police in the future. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958543) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:22 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm It's one thing to dump a case because there is no evidence to support prosecution.
However, it is entirely different to dump a case because I'm worried about "losing".
I've already lost a couple of cases. I'm not worried about my "record". |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:25 PM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams There isn't evidence to support prosecutions in most domestic violence cases with uncooperative victims. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958632) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:36 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm uh. . .photographs of the injuries.
- 911 phone call
- testimony of the reporting officer based upon what he saw and what the witness(es) told him at the scene. |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:37 AM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams Both are inadmissable self serving heresay. Do you know anything? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959401) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:45 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm You've never tried a case before, have you?
Either that or you are running low IQ schtick.
Please explain how I can't introduce photograph evidence if I have the officer on the stand that took the photographs and saw the injuries/scene that is depicted in the photos.
ALSO, please describe the situation in which I can't introduce the 911 tape if I have the dispatcher on the stand who answered the call.
*waits* |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:47 AM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams I was talking about repeating the victim's statements. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959479) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:50 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Yeah, I'm pretty certain you've never had to try a case and present evidence before. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959518) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:46 AM Author: Chocolate irradiated office The vast majority of dv charges don't involve obvious documented physical injuries bro (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959476) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:49 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm Not necessarily true.
In my jurisdiction, the cop will arrest the defendant if he sees physical injury against the victim and charge the def with <insert crime> Family Violence.
If the victim says, "he pushed me" and the cop doesn't see injury, then he'll instruct the victim on how to take out a private/personal warrant.
Most of the time the officer will observe and document the physical injury done to the victim. This is done to stop people from coming back days/months later saying, "Nothing happened, I just called the police cuz I was angry!" |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:55 AM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams Incredible police work here (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959560) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:58 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm It is my sincere hope that you are still this flippant and caviler when one of your female loved ones gets the shit kicked out of her by a significant other. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959598) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 1:09 AM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams Sorry I support a justice system based on proof beyond a reasonable doubt instead of knee jerk reactions. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959688) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 10:06 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm since when did the standard of arrest become BaRD?
Maybe you were sick the day that taught probable cause in law school. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:19 PM Author: aromatic ape Go hard after these motherfuckers. The women will almost never be on board until it's way too goddamn late. That doesn't make it ok. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958549) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:21 PM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm How do you handle them in your neck of the woods? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958576) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:29 PM Author: aromatic ape 99% of the time they go free because the woman won't testify, and our evidence is not sufficient to overcome Crawford without her.
But that 1% of the time when we get a 911 tape with an excited utterance during an ongoing emergency, I try to bend these guys over.If they plea, and it's a first time offense, it's a year probation with a certified batterer's program. If they force it to go to trial, I look or a split sentence with the same conditions, but like a month in jail. If it's a repeat offender, though, I'm going for at least a year to five years in prison, depending on the severity of the crime, whether children were involved, etc. I do not have much pity for these guys. As you know, they rarely even get reported, and when they do, it's because they usually have been beating the same woman for a long time. |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:32 PM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams How can you tell if an utterance is excited over the phone? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958726) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:42 PM Author: aromatic ape It's a judgement call on a question of fact, and there are often motions in limine filed and argued on both sides about this very question. The Crawford case and its sister cases set forth general standards - the utterance must be excited and nontestimonial. Generally this means that the 911 call must come in at the time when the crime is being committed or shortly thereafter, and the call must be placed to meet an ongoing emergency. So if you have a woman on the tape yelling "oh my god, please stop hitting me, that hurts, no, not in the face!" that is admissible. If, however, she calls 911 and calmly says "my boyfriend just hit me and I want to report a crime" that is inadmissible. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958840) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:44 PM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams That sounds easy to game. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958855) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:53 PM Author: aromatic ape It's not. No jury would convict beyond a reasonable doubt, and in fact, you would not even be able to survive a directed verdict (summary judgment) if the above tape is all you have. You still need to at the very minimum prove that the call is real; that it was the defendant, as opposed to someone else, who beat this woman up; that the beating was not in self defense, defense of other, or defense of property.
And that doesn't even take into account the human factors - it is astoundingly difficult to motivate a jury to convict when the victim herself does not want to go forward with the case. And it is almost impossible when she takes the stand herself and says "he never hit me". Yes, these women can and do lie to protect their abusers. It is super frustrating. |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:45 AM Author: azure beady-eyed useless brakes If I was on the jury and the woman was clearly lying on the stand I would definitely vote to convict on weak evidence. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959469) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:47 PM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams Isn't proof by assumption a logical fallacy? I was excited because I was being beaten. Wait, aren't you trying to prove you were being beaten? |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:56 PM Author: aromatic ape That's why judges often don't allow this evidence in. It's a fact-specific inquiry based on the evidence. If the judge hears a woman squealing like a stuck pig and hysterically begging for help, and sees pictures of her broken nose, it's reasonable to believe that the utterance is excited. This is based on a preponderance of the evidence standard, not proof beyond a reasonable doubt. The inquiry is not a question of guilt or innocence at this stage - merely whether a jury is even allowed to hear this evidence at all. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959012) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:00 AM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams Ty (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959039) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:09 AM Author: aromatic ape No problem. By the way, your doubts about all this are exactly why these cases are so difficult to prove. Jurors usually see these cases the same way you do.
From the prosecution side, we get cops who show up on the scene to find a woman whose face looks like a hamburger, a drunk asshole whose knuckles are all beat up, we see the pictures, hear the audio, see that 5 women have taken out abuse-prevention orders against him in the past, he has 4 prior domestic a&b convictions, and the woman provides a statement to the police. But we can't do a god damn thing about it because none of the evidence is admissible unless the woman is willing to come forward.
These are not like other crimes, where we have other witnesses who can testify, because by their very nature, they happen in a private, domestic setting. It's a bitch to try these cases.
By the way, I know that everything I have said comes off sexist, and I recognize that. Every once in a while we get a case where a psycho woman tries to knife her husband too. These cases are just as serious, but even harder to prove because juries are even less likely to sympathyze with a battered man. |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:14 AM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams Does the head prosecutor push you to try iffy domestic violence cases and not care if you lose? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959182) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:21 AM Author: aromatic ape On the contrary, I think there is more pressure than usual to settle these cases unless they are a sure thing because we know how juries feel about them. That said, my supervisor doesn't know or care about what we are doing unless it ends up in the paper. It's more a question of personal conscience and being able to justify your decisions if the shit hits the fan. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959243) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:34 AM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams What Is the typical plea bargain (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959361) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:39 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm I've found myself having my investigator go and personally serve the victim with a subpoena for trial.
That way she has to come to court and testify (unless they are married, which in my jurisdiction they rarely are)
Is that not advised in your juristidction? |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:41 AM Author: citrine roast beef laser beams Do you actually have the guts to throw a domestic violence victim in jail for contempt? Or are these transparent, toothless gimmicks? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959435) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:54 AM Author: haunting principal's office pisswyrm SOmetimes you have to shoot the hostage in the leg, Bro.
No seriously, if the victim doesn't want to cooperate, then I use the power of the court to compel her to come to court.
That way the defendant learns how serious the Gov't takes domestic violence.
It's easy to keep on beating the shit out of your g/f when you know that she's not going to show up on her own volition.
Most times, women will get pissed, but they'll show up anyways.
Once the Defense Atty sees the victim or learns that she's been personally served, the always take a plea. |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 12:01 AM Author: Violent Cumskin (shitboomer feminist) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20959056) |
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Date: June 25th, 2012 11:26 PM Author: Puce flatulent corn cake weed whacker cot damn meeting dat difficult burden yo (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1979193&forum_id=2#20958637) |
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Date: June 26th, 2012 1:06 AM Author: ruddy filthpig rigor I would be aggressive with it, use excited utterances and what not when you can. If you don't you just teach the victim that they police department is a magical free taxi service where they can call them up whenever they get mad enough at their man to have him taken away for the night and then the next day after they calm down it can all just magically go away.
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