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Wow, Latham... seriously?
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:06 AM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt seriously?
salary freeze. ftw. |
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Date: May 9th, 2009 3:17 PM Author: arousing lavender fanboi deer antler lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#11687175) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:37 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665506) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 1:57 PM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12667867) |
Date: December 16th, 2008 11:10 AM Author: Mauve Gas Station Ouch (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10533971) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:23 AM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10533999) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:24 AM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage ttt! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534002) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:27 AM Author: multi-colored smoky selfie damn. really? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534011) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:28 AM Author: insanely creepy brass lay yarmulke Ruh Roh (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534016) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:41 AM Author: Thriller self-absorbed mexican hospital pwned. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534054) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:42 AM Author: dull cerebral university immigrant the only ones surprised by this are dumb 2L who don't understand how the world works
you all need to shed this idea that associate salaries are composed of prize money that is set aside to reward you for your hard efforts in law school.
associate salaries are a function of profits. oh, and despite your beliefs to the contrary, none of you are entitled to shit |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:46 AM Author: Thriller self-absorbed mexican hospital good point. every law firm decision as well as the timing and specifics of that decision can be intuited once you understand how the "world works." (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534079) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:51 AM Author: ivory hissy fit lol, pwned (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534107) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 3:44 AM Author: trip office you are my favorite poster. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10539922) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 1:52 AM Author: Electric bonkers sex offender stag film nice (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10571958) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:31 PM Author: big-titted violent piazza filthpig DESTROYED (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10574649) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:47 AM Author: multi-colored smoky selfie http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oQp7Id8iRA4
EDIT: COOL, ALRIGHT, COOL, COOL, ALRIGHT (KICK IT) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:07 PM Author: maroon histrionic abode toilet seat given this board, i think this video is more appropriate: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G2nTbqbtGug&feature=channel (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534151) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 9:57 PM Author: insecure milky useless brakes site tyft (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537894) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:50 AM Author: ivory hissy fit way to take the gloves off and state uncomfortable truths. you truthtelling truthteller. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534102) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:51 AM Author: multi-colored smoky selfie COOL, ALRIGHT. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534105) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:45 AM Author: grizzly juggernaut address PWN PWN PWN (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534069) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:46 AM Author: tan cocky chapel personal credit line flame (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534073) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:46 AM Author: Sepia comical school http://abovethelaw.com/2008/12/reed_smith_salary_freeze.php
(Why ATL calls it "reed smith" in the title is beyond me.) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:47 AM Author: Vibrant Haunted Graveyard Point edit: nm, poster above beat me to it (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534084) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:47 AM Author: tan cocky chapel personal credit line wow (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534086) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:50 AM Author: Bull headed boltzmann puppy thank god for med school (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534094) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:51 AM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt Good thing they are freezing billing rates too... oh wait. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534103) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:53 AM Author: alcoholic ape Are things really that slow across all offices, or is this more a result of NY imploding? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534113) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:00 PM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt all offices from what I have heard. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534136) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:53 AM Author: grizzly juggernaut address Maybe they'd get some brownie points if they said in the memo "it was either this or firing a bunch of you shitheads." (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534118) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:57 AM Author: Thriller self-absorbed mexican hospital i would be happy if firms decide to deal with this downturn with mass salary cuts rather than mass layoffs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534131) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:02 PM Author: Vibrant Haunted Graveyard Point i agree (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534137) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:05 PM Author: mahogany contagious location Agreed, this isn't really bad news. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534145) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:05 PM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt except for the people who billed 2200 this year instead of 1200. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534149) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:08 PM Author: mahogany contagious location lol, yeah, suckers. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534155) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:10 PM Author: alcoholic ape If other firms freeze, it won't look so bad, but as of now I'd say it's fairly grim news for Latham associates. There's no guarantee there won't be massive layoffs next year in addition to frozen salaries. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534164) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 2:18 PM Author: vigorous ocher parlor jap FUCKING PRESCIENT AS SHIT (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12668024) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:51 PM Author: 180 Station FOR HILLARY!!! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534321) |
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Date: May 9th, 2009 3:11 PM Author: Chestnut Senate Fat Ankles (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#11687143) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:06 PM Author: dark house Absolutely. That's why I get pissed when the Above the Law constantly bitches about bonuses being cut (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534150) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 1:00 PM Author: frum space police squad agreed. it sort of funny to hear people on this board bitch about AIG or financial services execs getting bonuses then complain when struggling law firms dare take bonuses away from their associates (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534343) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:08 PM Author: tan cocky chapel personal credit line sure, but you're fully aware that won't be the case yes? They will layoff, rescind 3L offers, cut/eliminate bonuses and cut other costs TO MAKE SURE THEIR BOTTOM LINE (PPP) DOES NOT SUFFER. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534152) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:10 PM Author: Thriller self-absorbed mexican hospital edit: fuck it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534160) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:10 PM Author: tan cocky chapel personal credit line strange reply. EXPLAIN (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534163) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:10 PM Author: sick odious factory reset button You and every other associate. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534161) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:47 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage first, why do you assume salary cuts mean no layoffs?
second, what's so wrong w/ mass layoffs? if you're surfing the net billing 1000 hours a year, you deserve to get shitcanned.
at the very least, institute a salary freeze for those billing nothing instead of punishing people who actually do their jobs. |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:52 PM Author: boyish digit ratio Junior associates don't have very much control over their lack of hours. The finance and corporate associates billing 2200 last year are the ones who covered the litigation associates then billing 1800, and the success premiums on their fees (which often start off higher than lit fees) is what generated the salary raises and special bonuses last year. |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 1:12 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage yes, corp generates more money during booms, but lit was billing a lot, if not the same. even if lit associates were billing 1800, it's nowhere near as bad as corp assocs in many firms doing 1200 hours these days.
also, juniors might not have complete control over hours, but there is definitely some. i'm not at latham, but there is great disparity in the hours that people in my class are billing as juniors, and it's partly based on availability of work, partly based on initiative. a lot of them were happy coasting billing 10 hours a week. others were proactive in getting work. at a place like latham where you are unassigned, you can use some doc review during down times to increase your hours.
in a shitty economy, i dont think anybody should feel entitled to coast and still have a job. |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:27 PM Author: boyish digit ratio I will say that the unassigned system isn't as free as it's marketed, especially after your first couple deals. Most people are pretty much tied into a team or practice group, certainly by the end of their first year. Doc reviews go to the most junior people around because it's difficult to justify charging anything other than first year fees. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 7:33 AM Author: sick odious factory reset button Something tells me you would change your tune if you were one of the people without much work. The fact is that I would think that everyone would rather earn a bit less and avoid layoffs and feel a bit more secure every day and work less hours on average for a bit less money than see some people laid off in a shit economy.
That said, I do wonder if forcing a bunch of unproductive associates into part time would be better than an official salary freeze. |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 1:52 PM Author: Pink background story if you are only billing 1000 hours, that gives you about 800 hours of your own time to be looking for another job, since it should be obvious to you that you will get shitcanned. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534706) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:09 PM Author: glittery shimmering stain wow. just wow.
they must hate their associates. they just fucked them in the ass harder than anyone could have imagined. |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:11 PM Author: mahogany contagious location I think firing first years qualifies as harder (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534165) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:12 PM Author: Vibrant Haunted Graveyard Point especially for "performance based reasons" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534171) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:13 PM Author: mahogany contagious location "after 6 weeks, your performance is not what we expected. good luck finding a new job to pay off your massive debt." (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534172) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:24 PM Author: sick odious factory reset button My favorite was the firm that justified this based on summer associate performance. That was lulzy. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534200) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:39 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665517) |
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Date: December 18th, 2008 5:16 PM Author: charcoal motley base elastic band exactly; they "hate their associates." it's just unfathomable that they've made it so salaries don't automatically increase solely because it's a new year. only really uncool law firms make business decisions like this. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10549836) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:09 PM Author: Cracking glassy regret stage This is the point where you start to feel lucky to have a job, let alone pay raises. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534158) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:33 PM Author: beta doobsian love of her life seems fine to me
not a big deal |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:54 PM Author: mind-boggling candlestick maker set IBANKING PWNS LAW (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534327) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:14 PM Author: submissive massive resort severely underrated. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537143) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 12:57 PM Author: frum space police squad I don't get what the big deal is. its not like they rescinded offers or laid off half their staff
so their associates will be making the same 6 figure salary in 2009 that they made in 2008. cry me a fucking river |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:40 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch LOL (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665523) |
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Date: September 19th, 2009 11:34 AM Author: Seedy Macaca Generalized Bond cr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12784799) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 1:05 PM Author: Purple mediation orchestra pit Guys in my high school froze salaries during recessions all the time. It was no big deal. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534362) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 1:17 PM Author: drab aggressive doctorate EVERYBODY DANCE NOW (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534424) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 1:31 PM Author: Adventurous Cordovan Casino Rigpig I'd be feeling pretty fucking good if I was an associate @ Skadden. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534537) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:01 PM Author: beta doobsian love of her life you'd still be at skadden (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534757) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:12 PM Author: Adventurous Cordovan Casino Rigpig And though youd beat me in prestige points I'd be making much more than you. 1st yr at Skadden > 4th year at L&W. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534836) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:28 PM Author: charismatic coiffed pervert faggotry I wonder what would happen if Skadden kept its bonuses but froze salaries as well, esp if other NY firms do it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534965) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:31 PM Author: beta doobsian love of her life @ skadden (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10534980) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:46 PM Author: boyish digit ratio Only if the Skadden first year is above 1600 hours and the L&W 4th year is below 1900. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10535111) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:49 PM Author: Adventurous Cordovan Casino Rigpig Not exactly a huge leap to make.... (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10535132) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 3:20 PM Author: boyish digit ratio Perhaps, and it will certainly occur in some situations. But the more senior classes are certainly busier at Latham than the first and second years. So a meaningful percentage of them will hit 1900 easy. Similarly, the first and second years at Skadden are likely their slowest classes. So many of them may well come up short of 1600. |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 3:36 PM Author: Impertinent area You are quibbling about ways in which a 4th year at latham can still make more than a 1st year at skadden.
Do you see how pathetic that is, given that it shouldn't even be a question that a 4th year should make more.
Stop drinking the kool aid and give credit where credit's due. latham decided to fuck its associates (as have all the half-skaddens future salary freeze firms) and skadden is the only one looking good right now. |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 3:40 PM Author: Exhilarant institution what is the world coming to? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10535374) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 6:09 PM Author: Onyx associate titcr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542699) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:36 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage skadden should be commended for not fucking over their assocs like cravath and LW have done. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10535020) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 2:37 PM Author: beta doobsian love of her life i'm just f'ing with him (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10535032) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 6:42 PM Author: glittery shimmering stain will other follow? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10536478) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:16 PM Author: elite locus I had always thought Latham was more diversified than some of the NY firms - random F500 corporations, international clients, pe, banking and high yield work; would have thought they would have weathered better on average than say Cravath. Though it seems like the comments on above the law refer to lateral partner guarantees - suppose the system there is a less cohesive partnership (so more emphasis on bottom line?) unlike a lot of the ny firms so some folks are probably a lot more likely to cut and run. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537151) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:17 PM Author: maniacal headpube tanning salon Speculation is growing that they are a dissolution target. That would suck. 2000+ Latham attorneys on the market? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537158) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:18 PM Author: mahogany contagious location oh geez, speculation among who? How ugly is this gonna get? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537164) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:21 PM Author: maniacal headpube tanning salon Just bs I read on ATL. I think the economy is going to tank, so I imagine Latham, and all other firms, are going to go through really hard times. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537177) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:22 PM Author: razzmatazz very tactful stead The freeze looks bad and they're obviously hurting, but it seems like dissolution talk is premature. Why would they take the pr hit if they didn't think they could survive? And like the poster above, I always thought they had a fairly diverse practice. |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:27 PM Author: elite locus Anyone know anything Latham's indebtedness situation? Seems like Heller Ehrman was driven to some extent by their credit lines. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537210) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:29 PM Author: maniacal headpube tanning salon Good question. This will answer whether they make it through 2009. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537216) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:29 PM Author: mahogany contagious location why again are we speculating about a firm that froze wages instead of the firms like omm that fired first years? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537221) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:31 PM Author: maniacal headpube tanning salon We may see a few dissolutions in 2009 and 2010, with few, maybe, from the elite firms. Who knows? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537226) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 8:37 PM Author: razzmatazz very tactful stead No idea. The new offices in LA probably cost them something. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537257) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:25 PM Author: boyish digit ratio Law firms don't incur debt to pay a lease. The buildouts are often landlord financed improvements. Rumor is the lease is not more expensive than the old building. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10538766) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:41 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch LOL (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665529) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 9:45 PM Author: Lemon dead reading party funny, people were deriding me last night for describing a conversation i had recently with a T6 prof/biglaw figure about how this shit was about to hit the fan (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537788) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 9:52 PM Author: Big boiling water Latham layed off a huge number of associates in the 90s. You are all very short term thinkers. LaTTTHam and WaTTTkins......... (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10537843) |
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Date: December 16th, 2008 11:05 PM Author: abnormal nofapping public bath yeah, stop thinking about shirts you shirt term thinkers you! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10538553) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 1:31 AM Author: autistic karate Official line from the beginning of the year (the "no layoff pledge") was that Latham suffered for many years afterwards because they laid off so many future midlevels and seniors, and they learned their lesson and wouldn't be repeating it this time.
I guess nobody thought they might just cut salaries instead. Well, I suppose it makes sense. They'll save money and they'll keep most of their associates (nowhere to go), and if the economy/lateral market heats up, they can just brings salaries back up again. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 7:36 AM Author: sick odious factory reset button Exactly. If I were a managing partner this is exactly what I'd do. What else surprises me is that many firms aren't forcing non-productive associates into part time rather than laying them off. If you're only billing 10-20 hours per week, it might be better for the firm to pay you 1/2 your salary for coming in 3 days of the week than sending you packing. And if a big project comes along or the economy turns around they have reserve manpower. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10540018) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:49 PM Author: Razzle Market no. it makes more sense to lay that person off and add his work to an associate who's billing about 30-40 hours per week. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542009) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:51 PM Author: sick odious factory reset button Except when the economy picks up recruiting will hurt and they'll need people badly. With my system everyone is fine and when the economy ramps up the firms are ready for it. The incentives are still there - associates presumably would rather not earn a half-salary. The person billing 1900+ hours (Nutella, that's you) is happy. The person who can't get as much work at least has a job and no cause for complaint. Its an absolute win-win. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542027) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:53 PM Author: Razzle Market yeah, they'll hire a few less HYSCCP students for a year or two and then no one will even remember. so fucking what? in the long run it's a much better strategy (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542037) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:58 PM Author: sick odious factory reset button Is it? Those part time associates will be getting good experience so they'll have plenty of decently trained mid-levels, which is exactly who they'll need and want in a good economy. Currently, when the economy picks up it'll be a free-for all for the mid-levels and firms that fired will be on everyone's shit-list. With the internets people would be morons if they didn't google the firm before accepting an offer.
Personally, I would much rather accept an offer from Latham than from say, OMM given the info that has recently come out. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 8:36 AM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt Why the heck do they want to keep the bottom 10-20 associates from the first three classes? These are the people who checked out in April when making hours was not realistic.
If the market does not follow, Latham will suffer more from this than from cutting the dead weight. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 12:03 PM Author: alcoholic ape Honestly, what's morale like there this morning? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10540534) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 12:07 PM Author: carmine passionate heaven indirect expression 2 suicides already (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10540544) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:47 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage i think you'd be singing a different tune if you billed 1900+ and had to suffer a pay cut to subsidize the deadweights. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10541994) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:49 PM Author: sick odious factory reset button The fact is that you have no idea what you'll bill next year, and if you get cut then god help you. I know a guy who was doing great - until the partner who he mostly worked for took a leave of absence. Result? He's soon going to find himself looking for work in this market. Personally, I'd take the pay-freeze and be thrilled I have a job. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542011) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:50 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage 1) at my firm, we do not work exclusively for one/two partners.
2) yes, i know what i'm billing in 2009 -- over 2000. it pisses me off to no end that i might get ZERO bonus next year (given the cravath memo) despite having a busy year.
3) lockstep sucks. if you freeze salaries, freeze it for those billing under 1500. if you're gonna cut bonuses, eliminate it for those billing under 1500 (or some other threshold). why punish your best associates. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:54 PM Author: sick odious factory reset button 1) That seems pretty odd. Maybe its because I'm transactional - but you have several deals/matters and that's that. Partners get into a habit of coming to "their guys". At least, that's my experience.
2) Unless you're in bankruptcy or restructuring you can't possibly be sure of that.
3) I totally agree with this - establishing an hours threshold for bonuses would have been my first cost cutting measure. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:59 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage
as a selfish and greedy associate, of course i'd like to be compensated for my efforts accordingly. too bad the market sucks and i have no incentive to work. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 5:11 PM Author: sick odious factory reset button Yes, but wouldn't it make sense to pass on some work, enjoy life a little and still earn good money and not have some other poor bastard get fired? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542168) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 5:15 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage i'd rather have the poor bastard fired if it means i get more $$$ and my salary raise.
like i said, i'm greedy. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:51 PM Author: autistic karate I totally agree. Presumably that's what bonuses would be for, so we'll see if that happens. But absent that, it's definitely unfair.
High billers always subsidize -- especially when salaries/bonuses are lockstep, but even when they are not, the bonus is never proportional to the number of hours. |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:42 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch HAHAHA (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665540) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 8:55 AM Author: carmine passionate heaven indirect expression when's the gov't bailout? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10540049) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:41 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch eerily accurate (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665534) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 2:51 PM Author: razzmatazz very tactful stead Lol, now OMM is apparently paying above-market bonuses and not Lathamizing salaries. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10541499) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 3:06 PM Author: salmon trailer park legend Dang, turned down my OMM offer.
But, my firm has yet to announce bonuses. Hopefully OMM's move will prevent a follow-the-herd mentality. Funny cuz OMM typically is the one firm that always sticks with the pack or sticks with the pack minus 10% or so. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:50 PM Author: Razzle Market i don't understand why OMM is doing this. i know people at their NY and LA offices and they are literally sitting around all fucking day jerking off. ZERO work (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542018) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:51 PM Author: mahogany contagious location Opportunity to one-up a peer firm, and recover some pr after firing a ton of associates. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542032) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 4:53 PM Author: autistic karate The LA associates are getting $0 bonus if they haven't made their 1950 hours. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542042) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 5:00 PM Author: razzmatazz very tactful stead Going above market probably won't cost them too much, as there are probably a lot of associates who won't make their minimums. As for not freezing, or even leaving the possibility open, maybe things are just that bad at Latham. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 5:04 PM Author: charismatic coiffed pervert faggotry there are probably 20 associates at OMM who are over 1950 hours. by zero bonusing everyone below, they can easily afford it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542115) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 5:07 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage same shit at latham though. not that many people are going to get 1900, and i bet there's very little chance latham will do $27.5 for non-NY offices. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542132) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 5:10 PM Author: balding appetizing ceo den they jerk it in their offices? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542159) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 5:15 PM Author: Razzle Market (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542200) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 5:17 PM Author: garnet hall Should have chose WILDMAN dood (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10542232) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:27 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier I just started at LW in September, and I don't feel safe at all, especially after 1st years getting canned at Proskauer and now Gunderson.
I've already started sending in resumes to government agencies and smaller law firms, but my prospects are horrid ITE with little to no experience.
I was hoping for at least a year so I could make a sizeable dent in my loans, but I think that is wishful thinking at this point |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:31 PM Author: Racy effete bbw I am a stub at Latham too but started in October. Scared shitless. Everyone here is running scared, but we are running at 60-70% pace. I am hoping to make it through mid year next year. The freezing salaries to put off lay-offs seems like most cost cutting bullshit. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544205) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:33 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier I'd pray for mid year. Again, at this point, I'm cutting back expenses, trying to save as much money as possible.
And like I said, I've already started sending out resumes |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:36 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Damn. I feel like I should be doing the same. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544256) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:37 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier You know what's scary, you should ask around to fellow stubs and see if any have gotten business cards or gotten their bios on the web.
As far as I know, not a single stub I know in my office or any other office has gotten either done. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:40 PM Author: Racy effete bbw I had wondered over that but I think it is because they are waiting for people to get sworn in first......I think.
It is very scary. No one wants to talk about it, but you can tell people are fucking scared. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:43 PM Author: autistic karate Yes, at Latham you do have to be fully admitted in whatever state you're in (that includes C&F and the actual swearing in). Some firms may do it differently, e.g. give you the web bio before the business cards. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544328) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:54 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Nevertheless a great many people including, I fear, first years are going to get royally screwed. I had other firm options over the summer. Latham was a bad choice. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544425) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:48 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch prescient (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665583) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:56 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier Stop drinking the kool-aid, dooder. We are in some deep shit.
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:57 PM Author: Racy effete bbw "Stop drinking the kool-aid, dooder. We are in some deep shit."
tITCR |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:05 PM Author: Racy effete bbw BTW apart from resumes what else are you doing? I need to move on shit ASAP come January. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544506) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:08 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier Besides that, nothing. I don't know what I CAN do at this point.
I've contacted some people at other firms, but obviously they are looking to get rid of people, not add them.
I've been thinking of maybe getting an LLM, with the hope that by 2010 things will be better, but this seems risky to do and it'd add to my debt.
I think I'm just royally fucked. |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:10 PM Author: Racy effete bbw We are both in the same boat. I too think I am royally fucked. At the end of first year, if I make it that far, it will be time to see if I can get anything on the outside. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544547) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:12 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier Dude, are you talking about a FULL year, as in October 2009? We'd be lucky to last that long.
You might be in a better situation than me. I don't have a tech background or a clerkship or anything like that.
I think some of the stubs here that have COA clerkships and things like that will land on their feet.
If you are one of those, you are probably in an much better situation than me |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:16 PM Author: Racy effete bbw No tech background. No clerkship, I summered there last year. I am completely fucked due to lack of experience. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544605) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:17 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier Yup, same boat (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544613) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:49 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch holy shit this was right (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665587) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:41 PM Author: autistic karate NY stubs don't get admitted for a long time, but I know somebody in LA has his bio up. Don't want to single him out and don't know his other classmates, but if you have friends there then do a search. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544309) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:43 PM Author: Racy effete bbw How worried are you? I am in a slow office and as a fucking stub-year associate I am worried about being laid off. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544330) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 2:43 PM Author: autistic karate After hearing about the associate meetings in NY and LA, I think we have a bit of breathing room for the time being. Nothing is going to change in the next three months, so if the situation were really dire then they should be doing layoffs now and not just cutting some costs.
Let's see if anybody gets the axe during the review period and how bonuses turn out (for the ten people that will get them). |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 3:10 PM Author: boyish digit ratio I don't think there is any question that reviews are going to be much tougher this year than last year. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10573982) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:36 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier BTW, as I said in other thread, the freezing salaries to avoid layoffs is obviously horseshit, and I don't think anyone at the firm has said that was the purpose.
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:38 PM Author: Racy effete bbw It was total BS people were saying to make themselves feel better. Management is clearly trying to move people out, but with the economy in recession who is going to leave? People don't have options. One of the reasons for summering and ultimately going there was because the firm was supposed too be stable. What happened to that? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544286) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:51 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch latham is well diversified was complete horseshit (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665599) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:50 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665593) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:38 PM Author: splenetic tantric trust fund jesus. what firm out there is safe IN THIS ECONOMY? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544278) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:39 PM Author: Racy effete bbw None, but I think payfreeze but pending layoffs at Latham really have people shaken up. How bad are things at the firm? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544292) |
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Date: May 30th, 2010 2:10 PM Author: soul-stirring nowag (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#15118244) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:41 PM Author: glittery shimmering stain Some commenters on ATL described a quirk with Latham's retirement plan--the plan has to gain 5% a year and any deficiencies must be ponied up by the partners. Apparently the plan is down 50% like everything else so the partner's are having to cough up tons of cash on top of the sub-par year. This would explain why they took such a drastic move to save the firm in the near term at the potential expense of the long term (but they can always catch the classes back up to mitigate the long term damage). (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544311) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 9:42 PM Author: Racy effete bbw If this is true it could be a major fucking problem. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544326) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:52 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch shit! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665603) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:07 PM Author: Racy effete bbw I worry that Latham may become the Shearman & Sterling of this recession cycle. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544523) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:09 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier I think that's best case scenario.
Worst case, LW becomes the Brobeck of this cycle |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:10 PM Author: Racy effete bbw TITCR. If this pension thing has any legs we are all in very deep shit. I could see partners leaving over this. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544553) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:17 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier This is why all this talk about partners being greedy and doing this to maintain PPP level talk is all horseshit.
Firms HAVE to cut cost and maintain PPP levels. If they don't, rainmaking partners will leave for other firms.
It's scary how fast firms can go down if some key rainmaking partners split.
That's why LW (or any firm struggling for that matter) MUST try to keep PPP as high as possible, the survival of the firm litterally depends on it.
Unfortunately for us, that means payfreezes, layoffs, etc |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:20 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Yup. However, the root of all this is that partners are greedy SOB's who want to bleed as much as they can, it's just a vicious feedback loop. This is, of course, tangentially relevant at best. Back to the main issue, I am in complete despair over the job situation. Almost everyone in the office is too.
BTW I suspect some of the partners, many of whom are slow too, are going to get canned, especially the service/support partners-----> FUCKED |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:22 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier Yea, honestly, only the rainmakers are safe at this point. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544648) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:24 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Rough times dooder, rough times. There is a first year in my office that is wed to the idea of doing Corporate. Him = needs reality check. BIGLAW is a cold, brutal world. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544661) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:26 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier Lol. I can't even get doc review (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544682) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:27 PM Author: Racy effete bbw There's no doc review?
What?!?!
The???!?!?
FUCK?!?!?!?! |
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Date: December 18th, 2008 10:54 AM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage latham shouldn't have overhired, so the firm will be struggling more so than others who grow conservatively, but there won't be any sort of brobeck-style implosion.
once the fat is trimmed (not just low billers, but low billers who make no effort t oget work), it'll get better. if you're a stub, you doubt you have anything to worry about. |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:52 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch OMFG YOU PREDICTED THIS (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665605) |
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Date: December 17th, 2008 10:32 PM Author: insanely creepy brass lay yarmulke Is this JBD's new schtick? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10544726) |
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Date: December 18th, 2008 4:25 PM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt The stubbies bitching in this thread are hilarious. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10549546) |
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Date: December 18th, 2008 4:52 PM Author: autistic karate Seriously, they do not know how great they have it. They got a huge bar stipend (like $12,000? compared to NY firms that gave like $3000 in year-end bonus) and their salaries are exactly what they expected come Jan 1.
Maybe I have too many senior/midlevel friends but I agree that stubs are safe and the seniors/midlevels will be the first to go. That is just how attrition is supposed to work. Of course the seniors/midlevels are the ones who actually have some skills and knowledge, but it's the stubs who feel the entitlement and will actually get it.
This goes for every big NY firm btw (except for the fat bar stipend) |
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Date: December 18th, 2008 5:23 PM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt As a pissed off midlevel type, I agree - though there is some dead weight in the upper ranks too. It's hilarious to see stubs freaking out about partner pensions and other crap they are reading on ATL that they dont have the first clue about. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10549887) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:55 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch lol (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665620) |
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Date: December 18th, 2008 5:17 PM Author: charcoal motley base elastic band this is what people are talking about when they describe law students as a bunch of risk-averse sissies. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10549845) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 4:40 PM Author: autistic karate I've heard that in the past month or so, some juniors in LA were asked to leave within X months (X being 3 or 6 or something in between). Don't really have specific info as my friends don't have firsthand knowledge of events, but I've heard it from enough unrelated parties that it seems credible. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10574398) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 4:58 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Aren't you the same dood telling us that juniors were safe, just a few days ago?
I have been telling you all along dooder, we are in deep shit. |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:04 PM Author: autistic karate Unless somebody has more info, this is still just around the credibility threshold as far as rumors go. Also the LA guys who are closer to this are more freaked out about the associates meeting last week than this news. If they don't know who it is then they figure it must be some isolated cases.
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:05 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Now the question becomes just how screwed is the firm? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10574540) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:07 PM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt are you spewing more stub crap? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10574547) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:10 PM Author: Racy effete bbw In Jan 1, when I am no longer a stub, I will be in the junior associate ranks. Incidentally, the group that is in danger of being laid off.
HTH dood |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:14 PM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt The issue is not with your concern, the issue is with your broad statements about the health and financial position of the firm that comes straight out of your ass and is rooted in general bored stubbie malaise. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10574583) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:38 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Keep towing the company line dooder. You'll be out on your ass before you know it, because the partners will chop YOU TOO if it will increase their bottom lines. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10574675) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 7:02 PM Author: boyish digit ratio I'm curious as to how your proclaiming Latham's impending dissolution will save your job. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575080) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 7:51 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Actually I was wondering why the firm would freeze salaries with none of the competition following suit. Seems strange. I only care about saving my job. Sad thing is salaries are frozen and lots of jobs are going to be lost. Morale in the office is very slow. I am also in one of the slower offices. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575371) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:30 PM Author: autistic karate As far as I know there are only two big threats to the firm, and most other firms are going to find themselves in the same situation. The first one is collections; nobody knows what we can collect on and how much. I've been on some failed deals this year that I'm pretty sure we won't see a penny from in time for 2008, much less our invoice amount. The other one is demand for biglaw services and biglaw billing rates going forward. I haven't heard of any firms saying they want to lower billing rates, and nobody is predicting that deal volume is going to pick up anytime soon. That makes for a bleak 2009.
Again this is not Latham specific, and I wouldn't really rather be at Cravath with their 160 summers scheduled to start next fall. |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 9:28 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier Juniors as in stubs? Or like current 1st and 2nd years? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575769) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 10:38 PM Author: autistic karate Not stubs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10576381) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 10:54 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Seriously dood. You are harping on this, but in 2 weeks there won't be any stubs. How could you be at Latham being so dense? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10576509) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:00 PM Author: Racy effete bbw If you have V10 options, do not take Latham.
HTH |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:57 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch tcr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665631) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:07 PM Author: topaz meetinghouse coffee pot Mom, what are "stubs"?
I don't understand a substantial portion of this thread. |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:08 PM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt Stubs are people who just started. They become first years in January. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10574555) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 5:09 PM Author: topaz meetinghouse coffee pot Hey, neat: that's me! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10574558) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 7:09 PM Author: Mint Ratface Shrine this is not that surprising though really. latham expanded way too fast. spends money like crazy on its associates and summer program. paid like 250K bonuses for supreme court clerks. seemed too good to be true. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575108) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 7:52 PM Author: Racy effete bbw They are bloated. I have heard they may have to fire HUNDREDS of attornies. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575374) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 7:59 PM Author: house-broken shaky pocket flask newt Oh you HEARD? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575408) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 8:44 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Seems to be the thinking among quite a few associates here. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575582) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 8:24 PM Author: alcoholic prole sanctuary Latham is also the firm that fired folks in the 90s, changed their stipends to loans a few years ago when things got rough, and used to pay a lot less in bonus money than Gibson and OMM (before ATL and everyone knowing about it). I still can't figure out last year why their bonuses were so high. Totally out of character.
Like lots of folks, they're screwed in some practices and offices. London was a huge capital markets practice--now associates are billing like 400 hours a year. They've been doing stealth layoffs for a year, and have offered a buyout to others (6 months severance). There's been talk of Latham being diverse, but that isn't true. Their not alone in that, of course, but still. It's too bad, because the firm has some great folks. But they got into the capital markets like Brobeck got into the dot-com work. |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 8:44 PM Author: Racy effete bbw See dude, this is the shit that worries me. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575579) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 10:04 PM Author: submissive massive resort My theory is that it's less about capital markets than about over-reliance on a pipeline of private-equity-backed M&A work that has basically vanished and won't return. It would be better for Latham if it had more capital markets expertise. The SEC is about to be gutted and flipped on its head and that will create lots of work for securities lawyers. I think that's the main reason why Skadden and the NYC firms are in a stronger position for 2009 than Latham.
2300 lawyers isn't out of line with the size of most of the top larger firms and Latham grew at a much more even pace than the Baker McKenzies/DLA Pipers or even Sidley. The closest comparison to Latham is Skadden in terms of its size, pace of growth, geographic diversity and corporate-heaviness, yet Skadden is acting strong while Latham acts weak. Why? It sure as hell isn't because Skadden's bankruptcy practice is supporting 2000 other lawyers. My guess is that Skadden built client relationships and more capital markets expertise during the boom so that they can count on continued business and growth from their last 4 years of work. But Latham's litigators also appear to be slow, and that's the piece of this I can't figure out. Why would their litigators be so much worse off than their peers? If this is all about Latham being weak because of its size and aggressive growth why hasn't Jones Day imploded yet? What's keeping DLA Piper afloat? Their litigation groups are all really that much better than Latham's? Seems tough to swallow. It was all because of those 6 $250K bonuses they paid to a handful of SCOTUS clerks? I doubt it. Maybe the rest of the megafirms will all layoff hundreds in January and it will make more sense.
The answer that "Latham just delights in screwing its associates" doesn't make sense either. Latham hires a slew of legal industry consultants for every decision of this magnitude, and they dutifully gin up the law.com article to go out with the press release, etc. as we saw last week. Surely they pointed out stuff like "this could kill you in recruiting" and/or "you may never sniff the vault top 10 again." And btw, they hire all those consultants, and always wait until the end of bonus season to make their announcement specifically because they are trying to avoid another situation like the layoffs in the early 90s. Ask any Latham person and they'll tell you how much that episode is still discussed and criticized at the firm. The managing partner referred to it specifically when Latham made it's "no layoffs" pledge last March. So now I'm supposed to believe that partners at Latham changed their minds, or they don't like money, or are OK with being thought of as a lesser firm? It's just tough to figure out. |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 10:14 PM Author: lascivious therapy coldplay fan interesting read. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10576156) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 10:48 PM Author: boyish digit ratio LA litigation and ELR departments are pretty busy. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10576472) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 10:54 PM Author: alcoholic prole sanctuary Do I think they delight in screwing associates? Of course not, and it isn't what I said. Lot of good people there. But they have always been cheap (or, to put it in management's terms, well managed). And you're right about the 90's stuff--it was discussed and it was viewed as a horrible idea. Which is why they did the salary freeze instead this time around. Do the partners care about being seen as a horrible firm (by associates--that's an important element--not clients or partners)? Probably not as much as they like the extra money in their pockets, especially if their pension obligations do reach the rumored six figures per partner. And while Latham tries not to rely on a star partner system, Latham management knows that the one thing it cannot afford is a large group of partner defections. Recruiting will suck for a little while, but that is insignificant in comparison. Many CA firms had troubles after the dot com bust and hardly anyone remembers anybody but Brobeck.
One distinction between Skadden and Latham. 866 of Skadden's attorneys are in NY, billing at NY rates. Latham only has 385 in NY. Skadden also does not have lower billing offices like San Diego and Orange County.
With litigation, Latham just hasn't put the resources in lately. People stayed away from that department if they wanted a long-term future. So now who is left? Some folks, but it's not the strongest area for the firm.
We really don't know the extent of Latham's problems. Perhaps they are just being very conservative and thought more firms would follow. But they have a couple offices that are absolutely dead. And totally dead is a lot diferent from folks only billing 1600 a year. |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 10:57 PM Author: autistic karate Your facts are way off.
Private equity M&A is way down in this economy but it is not the main problem. PE buyouts didn't cause the credit crunch, they are just being hit very hard by it. PE can and will come back if (and for the country's sake, let's hope that's a *when*) the credit markets return to functionality. Otherwise Simpson Thacher would basically be dissolved by now.
Latham has/had a *huge* securities practice and this is actually a current problem more than a potential solution. Check league tables and you will see Latham is always on there in some capacity or another. But the capital markets are dead right now -- when's the last time you heard of an IPO -- and this is bad for Latham as well as Cravath, S&C, etc.
Latham litigators are slow? Check pace reports and report back.
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 11:01 PM Author: Heady ticket booth it's funny how people initially thought that sarbox would be a boon for IPO work, because of the additional legal guidance needed to navigate it. now that the economy and sarbox have choked the american IPO scene near to death, people want to repeal it. but that probably won't be done, because it would be seen as "deregulation" at a time when that is politically impossible. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10576578) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 11:02 PM Author: Racy effete bbw This is where I have to jump on board with you. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10576585) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:57 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch titcr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665636) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 9:45 PM Author: lascivious therapy coldplay fan Not to be captain obvious, but I take this as a sign that Latham is in trouble. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10575890) |
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Date: December 22nd, 2008 11:55 PM Author: Wild national sound barrier Cannot comment on LW's Transactional work.
However, I can say that Litigation is slowing down at a lot of BIGLAW firms. Basically, it's not just a Latham thing. I have friends at LW in LIT who are busy as shit, and some who are getting no work. I have friends at other BIGLAW firms who are the same.
Basically, companies are so unwilling to spend money in this economy that they are avoiding getting into new big litigation matters. Because of the long lasting nature of litigation, some firms have matters that have been ongoing for a while and keeping them busy. But I have heard of clients who are settling ASAP to avoid legal fees.
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Date: January 2nd, 2009 9:36 PM Author: alcoholic ape So have enough firms frozen salaries to give Latham cover on this? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10635150) |
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Date: January 2nd, 2009 9:40 PM Author: Federal school cafeteria round eye link to non-shitty firms following Latham's lead? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10635175) |
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Date: January 2nd, 2009 9:47 PM Author: alcoholic ape They might be the only (former) V10 to freeze. Still possible for a bunch of big firms like Mofo, PH, Milbank will follow. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10635215) |
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Date: January 2nd, 2009 9:48 PM Author: Federal school cafeteria round eye link to non-shitty firm that might follow? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10635225) |
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Date: January 2nd, 2009 9:41 PM Author: fragrant partner not any good firms...but we'll see. Still many top firms outstanding I think. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10635176) |
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Date: January 2nd, 2009 10:19 PM Author: alcoholic ape I wonder if we'll see any firms try to cut retroactively after collections are less than expected. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10635440) |
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Date: January 2nd, 2009 10:29 PM Author: Buck-toothed startling bawdyhouse old irish cottage no, that would be even more of a PR nightmare than saying freeze.
latham is not a market leader the way cravath is. |
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Date: January 2nd, 2009 9:52 PM Author: Racy effete bbw Looks like Latham is going to fire people sometime in the coming months. Definitely by summer I have been hearing. Shit. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10635254) |
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Date: January 9th, 2009 10:13 PM Author: french rusted sweet tailpipe psychic Any updates? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10687456) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 1:05 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch they laid off a lot of juniors, and first years in particular. they've fallen 10 spots in the vault rankings and will probably fall another 10 next year. people are demoralized. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665696) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 12:43 AM Author: Emerald center philosopher-king NICE (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665550) |
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Date: September 4th, 2009 1:04 AM Author: Sapphire bateful brunch ahh (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12665688) |
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Date: January 9th, 2009 10:25 PM Author: Titillating theatre kitty .. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#10687542) |
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Date: September 6th, 2009 1:54 PM Author: Maize Blood Rage Legal Warrant (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=900618&forum_id=2#12680175) |