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Question about European feudalism.

Was this system as singularly shitty as it sounds, or have m...
Dull Property
  06/14/13
just walk outside bro
heady garnet foreskin toaster
  05/29/25
(and yes, OP's country has a third world gini coefficient)
heady garnet foreskin toaster
  05/29/25
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nyuug
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nyuug
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Have most large-scale agricultural civilizations over the la...
Magenta gas station
  05/29/25
Yes, it was terrible, it was the first form of mass-egalitar...
Shivering hall roast beef
  05/29/25
(ignores every other form of mass-agriculture that preceded ...
Magenta gas station
  05/29/25
They were better because you had different tribal clans owni...
Shivering hall roast beef
  05/29/25
read the history of the early hydrological civilizations of ...
Magenta gas station
  05/29/25
Better to be a serf under a Warrior Clique (blessed by the P...
chestnut indian lodge
  07/01/25
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Abnormal blue hominid address
  07/13/25
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Appetizing green psychic
  07/13/25
what part of: the peasants are revolting, don't u get?
sinister goal in life mexican
  05/29/25
cq
azure associate shitlib
  05/29/25
I'd say that like slavery it probably depends on a lot on ju...
avocado church building
  06/03/25
teen black death survivors were the original Boomers
chestnut indian lodge
  07/02/25
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Chartreuse generalized bond
  12/18/25
i wish i could have sworn fealty to an employer like a serf ...
curious grizzly set
  06/08/25
Serfs had tons of time off & feast days. It wasn't as ba...
Naked cyan ape
  07/01/25
really depended on the country, the region, and the lord re...
Provocative State Voyeur
  07/16/25
It worked out really well for most folks. Asia had similar s...
pearly ticket booth old irish cottage
  11/11/25
it was a nanny state.
aromatic dog poop locus
  11/24/25
Most societies were nomadic. Home sapiens only became a sett...
pearly ticket booth old irish cottage
  12/08/25
actual feudalism was probably fine and shitty in parts four...
Provocative State Voyeur
  12/18/25
13th century English peasant: 1620 chill working hours per y...
floppy boistinker potus
  04/23/26
"Before capitalism, most people did not work very long ...
floppy boistinker potus
  04/23/26


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: June 14th, 2013 10:27 AM
Author: Dull Property

Was this system as singularly shitty as it sounds, or have most societies historically been based on similar systems?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#23393887)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 4:29 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster

just walk outside bro

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48969812)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 4:30 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster

(and yes, OP's country has a third world gini coefficient)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48969813)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 3rd, 2025 9:24 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48985020)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 8th, 2025 5:55 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48997575)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 1st, 2025 9:14 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49064860)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 3rd, 2025 8:14 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49070377)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 6th, 2025 8:32 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49077411)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 8th, 2025 10:20 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49084518)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 13th, 2025 6:52 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49098591)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 14th, 2025 5:12 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49101058)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 16th, 2025 3:43 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49105012)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 20th, 2025 8:00 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49117359)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 24th, 2025 5:37 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49128622)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 29th, 2025 11:50 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49141968)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 30th, 2025 6:59 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49143857)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 4th, 2025 6:52 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49156580)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 10th, 2025 8:35 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49172980)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 11th, 2025 8:33 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49421817)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 11th, 2025 8:48 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49421862)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 11th, 2025 8:57 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49421881)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 11th, 2025 11:28 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49422254)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 12th, 2025 7:15 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49424474)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 12th, 2025 9:29 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49425035)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 13th, 2025 1:21 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49425543)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 13th, 2025 4:52 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49427654)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 16th, 2025 8:27 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49436681)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 16th, 2025 9:03 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49436785)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 17th, 2025 6:11 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49439167)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 18th, 2025 7:01 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49441985)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 23rd, 2025 8:51 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49454945)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 24th, 2025 12:36 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49455274)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 24th, 2025 6:55 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49457596)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 24th, 2025 9:29 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49458108)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 26th, 2025 12:15 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49461550)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 26th, 2025 4:27 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49463581)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 26th, 2025 10:41 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49464738)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 27th, 2025 5:48 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49466319)



Reply Favorite

Date: November 28th, 2025 12:55 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49467160)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 2nd, 2025 6:52 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49478445)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 4th, 2025 5:54 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49484240)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 4th, 2025 9:25 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49484832)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 7th, 2025 7:20 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49492316)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 8th, 2025 12:55 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49493000)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 8th, 2025 8:23 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49495268)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 9th, 2025 3:57 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49497250)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 10th, 2025 9:55 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49500993)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 16th, 2025 9:07 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49515504)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 18th, 2025 1:04 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49518561)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 21st, 2025 8:59 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49529071)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 22nd, 2025 8:47 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49532458)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 24th, 2025 12:00 AM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49536032)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 28th, 2025 6:54 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49545634)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 28th, 2025 7:05 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49545665)



Reply Favorite

Date: December 29th, 2025 9:19 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49548639)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 4th, 2026 8:56 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49562700)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 6th, 2026 7:39 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49567730)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 12th, 2026 6:44 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49584404)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 14th, 2026 6:47 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49589879)



Reply Favorite

Date: January 20th, 2026 7:47 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49604959)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 23rd, 2026 7:08 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49838395)



Reply Favorite

Date: April 23rd, 2026 7:38 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49838453)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 13th, 2026 7:20 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49884309)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 19th, 2026 8:56 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49890852)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 21st, 2026 5:25 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49893306)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 25th, 2026 6:16 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49900593)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 26th, 2026 8:51 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49903004)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 28th, 2026 5:55 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49905466)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 3rd, 2026 5:16 PM
Author: heady garnet foreskin toaster



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49913565)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 7th, 2026 11:56 PM
Author: nyuug



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49985467)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 8th, 2026 7:24 PM
Author: nyuug



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49987106)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 9th, 2026 10:50 PM
Author: nyuug



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49989901)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 5:47 AM
Author: Magenta gas station

Have most large-scale agricultural civilizations over the last 5k years relegated the vast majority of their agricultural labor force /population to a state of semi-slavery enforced by an exploitative elite with a monopoly on violence?

yes

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48969854)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 5:51 AM
Author: Shivering hall roast beef

Yes, it was terrible, it was the first form of mass-egalitarianism. All the old Tribal Clans were abolished & people were turned into landless serfs, the only exceptions were the Elite Warlord Clans that got to rule as Lords/Kings.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48969860)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 5:55 AM
Author: Magenta gas station

(ignores every other form of mass-agriculture that preceded it)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48969863)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 7:47 AM
Author: Shivering hall roast beef

They were better because you had different tribal clans owning different regions, serfdom was a form of quasi-slavery, only the Kings/Lords had property rights.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48969954)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 1:37 PM
Author: Magenta gas station

read the history of the early hydrological civilizations of egypt, mesopotamia, the indus and the yellow river valleys

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48971066)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 1st, 2025 11:58 PM
Author: chestnut indian lodge

Better to be a serf under a Warrior Clique (blessed by the Priestly Clique) than a humiliated cog of the Merchant Clique imho

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49065184)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 13th, 2025 6:53 PM
Author: Abnormal blue hominid address



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49098592)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 13th, 2025 7:03 PM
Author: Appetizing green psychic



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49098608)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 8:52 AM
Author: sinister goal in life mexican

what part of: the peasants are revolting, don't u get?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48970037)



Reply Favorite

Date: May 29th, 2025 8:54 AM
Author: azure associate shitlib

cq

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48970041)



Reply Favorite

Date: June 3rd, 2025 9:32 PM
Author: avocado church building

I'd say that like slavery it probably depends on a lot on just where you are, so not singularly shitty just situation dependent

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48985033)



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Date: July 2nd, 2025 12:06 AM
Author: chestnut indian lodge

teen black death survivors were the original Boomers

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49065206)



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Date: December 18th, 2025 4:10 AM
Author: Chartreuse generalized bond



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49518664)



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Date: June 8th, 2025 6:07 PM
Author: curious grizzly set

i wish i could have sworn fealty to an employer like a serf to a feudal lord when i was younger. would have saved me a lot of pain cycling through shitty short-term jobs.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#48997602)



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Date: July 1st, 2025 10:15 PM
Author: Naked cyan ape

Serfs had tons of time off & feast days. It wasn't as bad as most people think. They didn't have running water or electricity, but neither did the rulers.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49065026)



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Date: July 16th, 2025 4:01 AM
Author: Provocative State Voyeur

really depended on the country, the region, and the lord

removing technology from the equation it could range from far more harmonious than what we have today to utterly hellish. the general trend towards centralization of power from the early middle ages and on and the rise of the professional state theoretically ensures a general better standard of living for a subject on average, or at the very least a set "floor" for QoL, but ends up removing a lot to do with the nuances of power relations and enduring senses of community in the process

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49105022)



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Date: November 11th, 2025 8:49 PM
Author: pearly ticket booth old irish cottage

It worked out really well for most folks. Asia had similar systems in place for thousands of years and they were stable societies

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49421865)



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Date: November 24th, 2025 10:06 PM
Author: aromatic dog poop locus

it was a nanny state.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49458174)



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Date: December 8th, 2025 8:26 PM
Author: pearly ticket booth old irish cottage

Most societies were nomadic. Home sapiens only became a settled species during the most recent 5% of our time on earth. There's absolutely nothing normal (or even good) about anything we do today, unless your goal is simply to put more people on the earth's surface

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49495273)



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Date: December 18th, 2025 1:07 AM
Author: Provocative State Voyeur

actual feudalism was probably fine and shitty in parts

foursquare feudalism otoh is a lot of fun and harmless if it's not infested with faggots

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49518563)



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Date: April 23rd, 2026 7:17 PM
Author: floppy boistinker potus

13th century English peasant: 1620 chill working hours per year with your bros, downtime all winter, zero "thank" emails

you: hiting 1620 billables in July while on your "working vacation" at the beach with your kids

https://groups.csail.mit.edu/mac/users/rauch/worktime/hours_workweek.html

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49838409)



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Date: April 23rd, 2026 7:17 PM
Author: floppy boistinker potus

"Before capitalism, most people did not work very long hours at all. The tempo of life was slow, even leisurely; the pace of work relaxed. Our ancestors may not have been rich, but they had an abundance of leisure. When capitalism raised their incomes, it also took away their time."

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=2281707&forum_id=2),#49838410)