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BigLaw Partner Taking Questions - Holiday/New Year Edition
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:26 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Stuck somewhere for work/holiday travel and doing nothing for the next hour or two. Fire away if anyone has any questions. As always, don't really care if you believe me or not, take my advice/answer for what little they're worth or don't, etc.
[Edited to say, for prior versions, please feel free to search threads starting with BigLaw Partner Taking Questions. As I may have stated before, I don't read this forum in detail so don't expect other readers to do that and know (or care) who I am. Anyway, you can search prior threads for additional questions I tried to answer in the past.] |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:29 PM Author: supple talking party of the first part trailer park What's your favorite holiday song? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634432) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:33 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I hate most traditional Christmas songs. Hit me with some Billy Mack instead! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634454) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:30 PM Author: Idiotic parlour Are you holding back this year? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634436) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:31 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den What do you mean? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634443) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:36 PM Author: Idiotic parlour in terms of Christmas shopping (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634472) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:40 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den No. It's not like I spend tens of thousands on gifts. Am I really going to try skimming a few bucks here and there on gifts for my loved ones? I do better than almost anyone I know. If anything, I spend more in down times because I know my loved ones may not be able to splurge on gifts they want. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634488) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 11:48 PM Author: Floppy insecure halford son of senegal are you Mark "there's no holding back" Flagel? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13662002) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:37 PM Author: Learning disabled nofapping office What would you think of a University of Florida undergrad student who attended Florida State University and is unemployed? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634994) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:40 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Go Hurricanes? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635015) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:41 PM Author: Sinister brass hall unintentional 180 brushoff (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635023) |
Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:29 PM Author: Fighting seedy set who sucks more Duke or Pac-10 football?
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:32 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Pac-10 sucks more at basketball. Duke sucks more at life. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634446) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:33 PM Author: Beady-eyed Twinkling Kitty Cat how closely do you look at a writing sample from a clerkship applicant.
what do you think about the following lit boutiques in terms of work quality, difficulty of getting an offer, interest in clerks, basically anything you could tell me would be great:
quinn
susman
boies
beck redden secrest |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:38 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I don't. I mostly look at judge/court and academic credentials (plus "fit" etc.) I'm sure if someone sent in a really crappy writing sample, it would disqualify them, but I don't recall ever hiring someone (or not) based primarily on their writing sample.
Top 3 are all great firms, although probably not the easiest places for junior associates to spend their first few years. The 4th may be a great firm as well, but I don't recall ever going up against them or knowing someone who worked there. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:51 PM Author: Beady-eyed Twinkling Kitty Cat which is the best of the ones listed, in your opinion? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634564) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:54 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I'd be bullshitting you if I ranked them. There's not much separating them as a whole. It's largely a crapshoot (based on who you end up working with at those firms, etc.) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634585) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:00 PM Author: Beady-eyed Twinkling Kitty Cat can i take your prior comment to mean that there tends to be less training at firms like this than the more traditional top of the heap vault firms? more sink or swim? if not, why is it that you descrie them as not the best place to spend your first 2-3 yrs
i have an offer open from a highly ranked vault firm but a big part of me wants to try to transition to a litigation boutique like quinn/susman/etc. any words of wisdom? |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:03 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Not at all. In fact, in many ways, quite the opposite. All I'm saying is that these elite "boutiques" are pretty similar to the "top of the heap vault firms." I'm throwing them in that lot. I just meant if I didn't care what I did 3 years from now, I'd much rather practice at a very solid "V100" firm than a "V5" firm or some place like Quinn. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634681) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:58 AM Author: khaki dashing weed whacker Susman > Boies >>> Quinn (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636326) |
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Date: December 25th, 2009 1:55 PM Author: Lascivious filthpig nursing home titcr. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13644050) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:34 PM Author: Autistic motley windowlicker center are you a parent yet? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634458) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:13 PM Author: Sinister brass hall congrats on the new baby. has it changed your goals or priorities w/r/t work? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634795) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:34 PM Author: Heady Athletic Conference Cruise Ship how much time will you take off for christmas? the associates who work for you? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634460) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:39 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I'll be taking off Friday through Sunday -- that's it. It's a brutal time at work...completely slammed. (Although I suppose that's a good thing, given the alternative.) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634483) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:42 PM Author: Heady Athletic Conference Cruise Ship ah that's not bad. i was half expecting something like "two hours while the kids open presents, but i'll be on the blackberry multitasking"
have a merry christmas |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:44 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I will almost assuredly be on email during those days, although I will try to minimize it. But just can't turn off email contact with the busy week ahead.
I did, however, tell all the associates to turn their blackberries off and enjoy the holiday. I doubt they'll listen. I won't email them first, but I'm sure they'll be in touch and I'll respond accordingly. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:48 PM Author: Sinister brass hall can i work for you? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634540) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:17 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Sure. I'd love to have worked for someone like me when I was a junior attorney. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634839) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:19 PM Author: Sinister brass hall where do i apply? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634864) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 11:15 PM Author: Curious maize haunted graveyard Why? What makes you such a good partner to work for (2nd yr here)? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635314) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:36 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I'm less of an asshole and more fair/reasonable/respectful/friendly than most. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636184) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:40 AM Author: Sinister brass hall any truth to the notion that asshole partners tend to be rainmakers who can pull for you, whereas "nicer" partners have no pull and can't protect you? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636212) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:44 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Some truth to it, but probably more so at other firms. And the reason its true at times is that people who are assholes usually rip apart associates, so on the off chance they say something great about someone, it holds more water. But it doesn't mean nicer partners can't pull for you. Basically it just comes down to how much value people put on a positive recommendation from you. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636235) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:47 AM Author: Sinister brass hall how do you determine who is a powerful partner who will go to bat for you? how do you align yourself with such people?
sorry to sound ignorant but i'm just a law student and don't have any relatives who are lawyers or anything like that. |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:54 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den You'll figure it out pretty early on who is a powerful partner. And you'll certainly know so by the time you're a mid-level or senior associate. Don't worry about this stuff in the slightest.
No worries. That's why I'm here ... I didn't have access to many lawyers growing up either. |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:56 AM Author: Sinister brass hall the managing partner of my office doesn't like me. am i screwed even if i work for different partners? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636314) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:21 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Why doesn't he like you? If its crappy work product, then yes, probably still screwed. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637394) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:34 PM Author: Sinister brass hall what type of firm should we be striving to start out at? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634466) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:41 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Depends on your goal. For someone who wants to practice only 2-3 years and get out, most NYC firms and places like Quinn seem to be a pretty poor idea (in my mind). Why kill yourself that much if you aren't going to stick around to see the benefits of that? On the other hand, I guess if you're only doing this for 2-3 years, that name on the resume will help...but still. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634493) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:43 PM Author: Sinister brass hall what's the credited path if you want to make partner and still enjoy living? also, what's wrong with quinn? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634499) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:48 PM Author: Citrine skinny woman What's the credited path if you want to make money and still enjoy living? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634544) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:52 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Nothing wrong with Quinn. They do great work. And they work very hard. But I'm a lifer. So that lifestyle makes sense to me. My point was that if you're only in this for 2-3 years (to pay off loans or whatever), why would you work 2500-3500 hours/year when you can work 1800-2500 hours? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634571) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:55 PM Author: Citrine skinny woman Are you a "lifer" because you're striving to amass a certain amount of money or because it's all you have? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634596) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:56 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Object as to form. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634601) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:58 PM Author: Sinister brass hall over the life of your career, was there ever a turning point, where you felt like things were only going to get better? what sorts of milestones can juniors look forward to if they hope to become lifers? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634624) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:09 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den It gets better when you start doing work yourself instead of prepping others to do the work. I found that to increase job satisfaction tremendously. For most of you who start in biglaw, I imagine that's in the 2nd-3rd year when you start taking depositions etc. yourself. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634757) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:11 PM Author: Sinister brass hall do you think places like quinn give their juniors early responsibility more so than traditional big firms, or is that just marketing gloss? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634773) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:19 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den "early responsibility" is a bullshit marketing/recruiting phrase. I don't care what firm you're talking about. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634865) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:22 PM Author: Sinister brass hall so we're all condemned to discovery and being everyone's prep bitch for the first few? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634879) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:25 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den For the most part, yes. At my rates, clients can only afford me if the dispute is worth millions at the very least. You barely know how to turn the lights on when you start. The study of law teaches you NOTHING about the practice of law. Why would you trust you with any responsibility in a multi-million dollar case. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634904) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:29 PM Author: Sinister brass hall so how do i reach the turning point sooner? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634940) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:35 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Be really, really good at the tasks you think don't mean much. If I can't even trust an associate to make a good depo prep outline, I sure as hell am not going to trust them to take a depo. If I can't even trust an associate to do basic research and memo writing, I sure as hell am not going to trust them to take the lead on writing a major brief. If a senior associate tells me a junior associate fucked up by not catching some document during a document review, I sure as hell won't be going to that junior associate for more substantive work any time soon. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634986) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:38 PM Author: Sinister brass hall ty. any other "typical" mistakes that the average top law graduate would be oblivious to? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635002) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:42 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Not really. Just be great at what you do. Whatever the hell you are assigned to do, do it flawlessly. If your job is to copy a freaking binder and carry it to a conference room, make sure it gets there. I don't care if the guy at the copy center fucked it up or if you secretary didn't deliver it in time. If you're responsible for it, I expect you to be responsible for it and not screw up. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635028) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:43 PM Author: Sinister brass hall and just do that until i get noticed? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635040) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:46 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den You'd be surprised how quickly people notice. Junior associates have no idea just how scared senior associates are let down partners. When I go to them and ask for something to be done right, you can bet your ass they're going to go to the junior associate they trust/have heard good things about. Because just like your ass is on the line if your secretary fucks up, their ass is on the line if you fuck up. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635064) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:50 PM Author: Sinister brass hall what kind of work should i seek out if/when i start getting the option to choose? i.e., what will help me develop good skills and get me out of boring work? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635108) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:36 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I always thought the smaller the team, the better. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636190) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:36 PM Author: sienna pit coldplay fan How safe should a 2L with a lower v100 SA position feel right now? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634473) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:42 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den In terms of summering next year? Very secure.
In terms of starting the following fall? Probably not that secure. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:44 PM Author: sienna pit coldplay fan Why not that secure? My firm reduced over 60% from last year levels, which were reduced. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634502) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:06 PM Author: sienna pit coldplay fan (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634722) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:09 PM Author: thriller giraffe we need an answer! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634751) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:10 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den That doesn't really mean much of anything. Depends entirely on the firm. For many firms, that should probably give you great comfort. For your firm, who knows. Write the name of the firm if you want and I'll make a rare exception and try commenting on the particular firm (if I know anything or have any thoughts). (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634770) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:12 PM Author: sienna pit coldplay fan (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634787) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:16 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I regretting making my offer the second I did. I really don't want to answer these types of questions because no matter what I say, people are going to give it more weight than my comments are worth.
Anyway, it depends on what department you end up working in etc. I don't have any reason to believe [edited] is in worse shape than other firms. I know no non-public information on it.
My broader advice is that you shouldn't worry about thigns you can't control. You have put yourself in a great position. Half of what happens from here on out is luck. Hope for the best and move on. That's where you're going next summer. THat's hopefully where you will start your legal career. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:17 PM Author: sienna pit coldplay fan Ty. Can you edit out firm name please (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634840) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:13 PM Author: thriller giraffe also interested in cadwalader and schulte (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634801) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:14 PM Author: sienna pit coldplay fan You can't possibly be splitting. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634808) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:17 PM Author: thriller giraffe my roomate and me (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634843) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 11:18 PM Author: Curious maize haunted graveyard you recognize that CWT is a horror-show for jr assocs, right? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635336) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:36 PM Author: Hairraiser dun ticket booth Cravath offering 0 of their 80 class of 2002 associates partner: dirty? Or par for the course? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634475) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:45 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I don't know about "par for the course," but not that surprising. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634510) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:38 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican how do you look for local counsel in small states? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634480) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:46 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Ask my partners/contacts for recommendations if I've never worked with anyone from that city before (which is rare). Sometimes in-house counsel recommends someone. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634522) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:47 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican im talking like NH/VT/ME (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634531) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:53 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Not exactly hard to find local counsel in the Northeast. It's full of people from New York/Boston who set up shop there or can provide contact info. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634575) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:56 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican You know an attorney practicing in New Hampshire? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634604) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:00 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Personally? No. It would take me all of one email and 5 minutes to find one though. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634647) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:00 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican im just wondering who it would be. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634652) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:03 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I don't know what this means. Surely you don't think I'd provide you a name even if I knew one off the top of my head. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634691) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:07 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican I'm curious to know whether you'd end up with my firm. Im a second year associate and I never know how my bosses get these local counsel gigs. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634741) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:21 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den All it takes is one case. Work with us once, and if you meet our standards, any time we come back, we'll consider you. I usually send out a request to people asking if they know someone. I almost always get an answer back in 10 minutes suggesting a firm and providing prior experiences. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634877) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:29 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican Thanks. Do you typically like working with yes men, or with people with their own strong ideas on how to win a case?
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:40 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Why on earth would I want to work with yes men? I'm looking for people to trust with important work. Looking for people who can handle things even when I'm not there to spoonfeed them stuff. If you can't take ownership of something and don't have strong analytical/technical skills and confidence, I don't have much use for you. Conversely, some people who have "their own strong ideas on how to win a case" are insufferable jackasses who don't realize how ignorant they sound when they share these ideas with you. So at the end of the day, I expect you to speak up, but I expect you to do so only when you have something productive to contribute. The douchebag first year who thinks he has some brilliant idea no one else has thought of is usually a pain to deal with. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635012) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:39 PM Author: Heady Athletic Conference Cruise Ship Would the following statements make you cringe if spoken by one of your fellow partners?:
1) “There’s no holding back this season,” said Barneys shopper Mark Flagel, a partner at law firm Latham & Watkins in Los Angeles. “I’m personally hopeful that the mood is better and the economy is better. Because what is there if there isn’t hope?”
2) The reason Cravath didn’t elevate anyone this year, says this partner, is that the pickings were slim: “We want to make partners even in bad economic times. But this year, no one met our standards.”
[Source: abovethelaw.com] |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:50 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den 1. No. I read that on ATL actually and was surprised and the big deal people made about it. I think the poor guy was probably trying to sound positive/cheerful/hopeful about the future and came out sounding horrible.
2. I want to say "no comment" on this one (if for no other reason than to avoid a pissing match over this comment). The guy was honest...it may have been stupid to say, but he was honest. Part of the partnership process is figuring out what the firm's needs are and if the firm can handle giving out another piece of the pie. Cravath decided it couldn't do so and no one they had met the standards this year given the parameters they use to make that decision. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:54 PM Author: Heady Athletic Conference Cruise Ship fair enough. but on #2, wouldn't it bug you that random partners were talking to the media about this? to me, it seems like an internal matter *they* should have said no comment to. or am i off base? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634589) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:58 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den No, I agree with that. Having said that, it really doesn't matter much to anyone except people on forums like this/ATL. Do you guys really think practicing attorneys at 99% of firms wouldn't take a Cravath senior associate in a second? THat people in the practicing world will think these senior associates are somehow not elite lawyers? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634630) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:00 PM Author: wine clown I'm personally not convinced that hiring managers at lower firms outside of BIGLAW really are capable or even desire to distinguish between a Cravath senior's value and the value of some Thomas Jefferson grad ADA (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634651) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:05 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den What are you defining as Biglaw? There's almost no chance that a Cravath senior associate couldn't lateral to a firm that starts at 160K. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634707) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:07 PM Author: wine clown I'm talking more about a Cravath senior trying to lateral into a midlaw firm that handles a lot of PI.
Outside of the V100, I'm not sure most lawyers even know what Cravath is. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:09 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican that doesnt sound like a good fit for either side (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634756) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:13 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Why would a Cravath senior associate want to lateral to do PI work? Why would a PI firm hire a Cravath senior associate to do that work?
And I disagree entirely with this comment. You're telling me the Vault "best of the rest" firms or the AMLAW200 firms etc. don't know about Cravath? The average person working there may not ... I assure you the person in charge of lateral hiring do. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:14 PM Author: wine clown Interesting point. I only asked because so many hiring managers in medicine tend to be unfamiliar with the best med schools outside of Harvard (even Coordinators) I wasn't convinced that many midlaw and shitlaw firms were going to be much different. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:18 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Even if they weren't aware before, I assure you they'd be aware when some annoying recruiter called to say he had a CRAVATH associate interested in the firm .... you know ... CRAVATH ... one of the 1 or 2 most prestigious law firms in the world. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634856) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:42 PM Author: Heady Athletic Conference Cruise Ship damn dood do you work at CRAVATH? jk (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635032) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:59 PM Author: flatulent mental disorder step-uncle's house Firms are really interested in hiring failures with no book? People who suck SO MUCH ASS their own firm says they SUCK ASS? Jesus.... (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635195) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:41 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den You're speaking like a xoxo poster here (read: someone who sounds largely ignorant about the real world). If I was hypothetically looking for a lateral to make a first-year junior partner, I'd personally probably pick the Cravath 8th year who didn't make partner over the [insert mediocre firm] 8th year who just did. It's laughably ignorant to refer to these associates as "failures" who "SUCK ASS." 99.99% of this board wouldn't make partner at Cravath. That doesn't mean everyone here is a failure who sucks ass. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636219) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:39 AM Author: khaki dashing weed whacker LOL ya, Debevoise is just dying to get some Cravath 8th years!!! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636205) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:47 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Are contextual understanding and reading comprehension foreign concepts? My point was plainly that a Cravath 8th year can get hired at SOME firm that starts at 160K; not necessarily at ALL firms that start at 160K. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636253) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:52 AM Author: khaki dashing weed whacker a rather wordy reply dood. a cravath 8th year MIGHT get hired at Baker Mackenzie etc. hardly a sure thing and most lit 8th years will end up at boutiques (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636287) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:42 PM Author: boyish poppy tanning salon ... (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634494) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:46 PM Author: sienna pit coldplay fan ;) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634524) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:55 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Back when I was involved in this more intimately, I wouldn't have cared at all. Who the hell knows now. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634597) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:53 PM Author: thriller giraffe best advice for a 2010 SA? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634578) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:09 PM Author: thriller giraffe (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634759) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:23 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Don't worry. Be happy. (Seriously.) In hindsight, you'll look back at this time period like you probably look back on people who freaked out in college. Go get hammered. Go try convincing two sluts to have a threesome. Go read for pleasure. Go play video games. Do anything besides worrying about what the hell you'll be doing next summer. (Unless, of course, you don't have a job already.) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634891) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 9:58 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican whats your jury trial w/l record? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634628) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:01 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den No comment. (And certainly not because I'm remotely ashamed to share it. I've been reasonably lucky/good.) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634658) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:02 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican ok, winning percentage? have you tried more than 10 cases to verdict? |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:05 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Very very high.
Yes. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:08 PM Author: wonderful plum area mexican what is your secret? Clearly you communicate well. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634746) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:27 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den No secret. I'm a good lawyer. All good lawyers should have a high winning percentage at trial. If not, you should be settling those cases. I've also been relatively lucky. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634925) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:03 PM Author: wine clown What do you think about the fact Harvard UG and Harvard LS (as well as all other TTT private colleges and their peers) have increased tuition by 90% in 5 years?
What do you forsee this 5%-10%/year increase becoming standard will do to higher education? |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:07 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den What do I think about Harvard doing it? No big deal. It's worth it.
What do I think about BC/BU doing it? Eh, probably still not that huge a deal, although very concerning.
What do I think about Suffolk/Northeastern/etc doing it? God help everyone involved.
What do I think this will do? Result in more cries for student loans to be dischargeable via bankruptcy. |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:11 PM Author: wine clown Debt situation for many young americans will be so high soon that they cannot hope to pay it off with 4 year degrees anymore?
What is your opinion of the false information spread about median salaries for graduates at places like Cardozo (which claimed to have a median salary for $115k last year), and does this bother you at all or cause you any concern? Did the $500 million University of Pheonix had to pay for false employment data make you think about suing schools? Would your firm ever let anyone file suit against places like Cooley/Charlotte School of Law/University of Detroit-Mercy?
(asking these for BIGLAW firm perspective, if any, on such issues) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:29 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Can you link me to a good story on the U Phoenix case? I'm not sure if I was aware of that.
I don't know what you mean by would we ever let anyone file suit against law schools. Would I file such a suit? Probably not. Would I if there were no conflicts and a client wanted me to? Sure. I'll sue just about anyone if I think I have a valid claim. (Or more accurately, I'll defend just about anyone.) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:32 PM Author: wine clown Cool.. that's more or less what I was asking.
Let me try and find the UoPhoenix class action in CA.
Here's the DOJ claim: http://www.lieffcabraser.com/consumer/university-phoenix.htm
I'm going to look for the other suit they lost in the last 4 years. Similar case on for-profits being OWNED: http://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta/lawsuit-charges-university-with-122757.html |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:44 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Wow, I really have been buried in work recently. I've done a fair amount of FCA work in my time. Wasn't aware of this settlement in Dec. 09. I'm sure it was covered in one of the 20 newspapers/journals/magazines piled up in my inbox. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635056) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:08 PM Author: Sinister brass hall what did you get your wife for christmas? how do you know she's not cheating? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634749) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:09 PM Author: Buff plaza striped hyena Do you think that it still makes sense to go to a top 14 law school in this economy? At what point do you think it's wasted time and money? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634754) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:34 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den If this is what you really want to do, absolutely. (It may not make sense to go to mediocre schools in this economy...) It's not wasted time and money if you really want to do this. If it's purely an economic decision, I'm not sure law school has been a good idea for a long, long time. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634970) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:12 PM Author: Sinister brass hall what are you thankful for? what do you look forward to? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634789) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:24 PM Author: tripping lay How much did you spending on your wife's engagement ring? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13634897) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:46 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Going to take a quick break to eat/stretch. Will be back online later if I'm still stuck in this hellhole. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635070) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 10:55 PM Author: medicated hominid When hiring, do you differentiate that much between a UCLA/Texas grad as opposed to lower T14s, other things being equal? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635158) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:47 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Not really. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636258) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 11:19 PM Author: Curious maize haunted graveyard Do you regret going into lit? If you had gone transactional, do you think you might have had the opportunity to do something else (like finance, company position, etc.)? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635344) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:49 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Absolutely not. I'm biased and barely consider transactional lawyers to be real attorneys. I'd do litigation for half the pay of doing transactional work. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636267) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 10:08 AM Author: Curious maize haunted graveyard Would you still feel that way if you had failed to make partner at a v100? (mindful of your boast re: half the pay).
Is major corporate lit (ie a paper war to delineate the settlement) really that satisfying? I'm sure for the head partner it is, but the legions beneath him seem to have a miserable lot. |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:22 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den It has nothing to do with being partner or how satisfying major corporate litigation may be. Transactional work is not for me. Period. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637404) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 11:22 PM Author: Grizzly Internal Respiration Immigrant Do you feel lucky to have gone to law school when you had to compete with far fewer people, when tuition was affordable, and when law firms were hiring? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635375) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 11:51 PM Author: Hairraiser dun ticket booth Could you imagine how sweet it would be to get into law in the 70s? No LSAT. You could be a 150s type and still get into Harvard and work you way to partner in BIGLAW billing 1400 hours. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635638) |
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Date: December 23rd, 2009 11:55 PM Author: Grizzly Internal Respiration Immigrant I have a hard time imagining it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13635667) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:00 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I feel lucky in general. But I reject the notion that my generation necessarily had a much easier time or that we felt any luckier or happier. You may be right that you have it tougher than I had it, but you are ignoring that your peers also have it tougher than mine did.
My point is that concepts like "happiness" and "job satisfaction" are shaped in great part by societal expectations. If everyone around you is working 1900 and you work 2200, yes, you'll be pissed. If everyone around you is working 1500 and you work 1900, you'll be pissed. Is the guy billing 2200 in the first situation necessarily less happy than the guy billing 1900 in the second? I'm not sure. |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:35 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Probably absurd to be signing back on at 1:30, but I enjoyed the previous discussion on this thread so came back to the site to see if there were any updates.
[By the way, can someone tell me the backstory on "poast"? Is this one of those xoxo memes (e.g., a few years back, I used to see people say "dooder" a lot.)?] |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:35 AM Author: Sinister brass hall yeah it's a meme. we're poasters now.
i had a followup question here http://xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&mc=119&forum_id=2#13635108
and here http://xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&mc=119&forum_id=2#13634795
and you left these unanswered http://xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&mc=120&forum_id=2#13634749
http://xoxohth.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&mc=121&forum_id=2#13634789 |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:41 AM Author: razzle pocket flask What should I try to do this 1L summer? Mass-mailing BIGLAW firms seems totally wasteful. My parents work at large corporations in non-legal jobs. It also seems a little hopeless to try to get something in-house. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636217) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:57 AM Author: razzle pocket flask Rude! (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636319) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:23 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den It doesn't really matter as long as its something law related. Go work for some public interest organization at the very least. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637411) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:44 AM Author: khaki dashing weed whacker HYP ug, CCN law review and top grades, third year at v10 firm, got my walking papers. what should i do now. i knew i was getting pushed out before it happened and interviewed with about 5-6 V50-V100 and couldnt get an offer. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636239) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:52 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den practice area? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636289) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:56 AM Author: khaki dashing weed whacker gen commercial lit. thinking of ausa now. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636311) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:03 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Obviously, if you can get it, that's a no brainer. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636347) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:05 AM Author: khaki dashing weed whacker long shot. they'll call up partners at the firm, who will say "underperformer" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636353) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:25 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Doubtful, unless you work for assholes or your work was really bad. We don't throw people under the bus like that, even when they are ushered out, unless their work product is really bad. Having said that, I'm sure it's a long shot for other reasons as well, but just saying... (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637419) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:53 AM Author: Duck-like range gay wizard Would having a criminal record affect being hired at your firm/firms in general? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636290) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:55 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Depends on the crime. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636306) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:55 AM Author: Hairraiser dun ticket booth a few dwis here and there ain't no big thang (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636307) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 1:59 AM Author: Duck-like range gay wizard Assault and battery. I mean would they be generally hesitant to hire anyone who may have C and F problems (assuming they had no ethical qualms with the crime itself)?
Also, if the crime was cleared via a diversion program would the firm's background checks still be able to find it? Would you recommend full disclosure, even if not legally required? |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:00 AM Author: Hairraiser dun ticket booth You will be the enforcer sitting for trial. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636338) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:27 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den You'll probably have to explain it to HR. And yes, I generally suggest full disclosure. I don't know what "crime was cleared" means, but they'll probably ask you if you've ever been arrested/convicted, so you'll need to disclose it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637424) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:08 AM Author: cobalt ceo How do you view T10 URM candidates in comparison to non-URM t10 candidates?
I seem to remember you not having a very fond opinion of URMs in general (or maybe that was another poster?). |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:28 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den T10 URM are obviously much more highly sought after. I don't know what your second comment means. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637427) |
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Date: December 26th, 2009 12:43 AM Author: self-absorbed piazza I think his second comment is in reference to you refusing to tell me how to get cherry 1L diversity gigs for the past year despite my increasingly desperate entreaties. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13647852) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 9:22 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Are you the same guy who always asks me how to get a sweet 1L diversity gig and then can't even tell me which firms are still hiring 1Ls in this market? Sorry I can't advise you on the best way to land a largely imaginary job. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13660422) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:12 AM Author: Clear theater stage #1 I am opposing a scheduling motion.
What do you think of sending the judge two proposed orders with my oppo brief, one that says "motion denied" another that has a compromise that i offered the moving party and was rejected?
the oppo brief would argue the motion should be denied, but then say "hey the other side should have accepted our compromise" and then propose that as an alternative to granting the motion.
#2 on a similar topic, does it make sense to make proposed orders summarize a few main points in your brief? in theory if i were a judge i might appreciate it saving me and my clerks some time drafting.
i have never done this before however because I don't see other people doing it, and don't want to stick out.
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:30 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I've never submitted two proposed orders before. I wouldn't submit one for the argument you're making in the alternative.
Be careful when you try turning the proposed order into an advocacy piece. You risk pissing people off if your proposed order "summarizes a few main points in your brief."
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Date: December 26th, 2009 12:17 AM Author: passionate state incel District court clerk here.
#1: submit only one order; if the judge wants something else, he will ask for it. in general, our chambers drafts every original scheduling order ourselves (although the judge will sign form orders for extensions on occasion).
#2: absolutely not. if the judge thinks something is worth writing on, he will decide to either drop a FN or have a clerk draft a short memo. for most scheduling matters, an order would essentially be:
"on [date], upon consideration of [motion], Plaintiff's request for an extension is granted. the case will be listed for trial on [date]."
[if several dates change, they would be enumerated in a list] |
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Date: December 26th, 2009 2:20 AM Author: Ocher rigpig man, i LOVE gavel orders (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13648399) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:18 AM Author: dark slap-happy dragon crackhouse Class of 08, transactional, at a regional firm in a city in the second quartile of population. We are arguable the top firm in the city.
Spouse has some opportunities in major markets but obviously my employment prospects scare the hell out of us for obvious reasons.
I did pretty well in school, but not rockstar.
Thoughts? |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:31 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I wouldn't move unless I had a job lined up elsewhere in advance. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637435) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:25 AM Author: Clear theater stage how much ITE are 2nd tier biglaw firms (firms with PPP in the 500-800 range) charging their clients to bang out 25 page 12-b-6 motions to well-written complaints?
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:20 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I don't know...$20-25K? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637388) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 2:56 AM Author: Vivacious fortuitous meteor Good biglaw flame-out job after a year or two? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13636538) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:32 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I'm not aware of any after just a year or two, unless you go into the public sector. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637439) |
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Date: December 25th, 2009 4:07 AM Author: Vivacious fortuitous meteor What public sector stuff are you thinking of in particular? Merry Xmas. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13643174) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 9:23 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Go into various low-level federal/state agencies; go work for your local city/state. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13660432) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:02 AM Author: Odious pervert I'm a second year associate, and I'm thinking about taking my home state's bar exam. When HR or the partners in my group find out about this, do you think I'm going to be in any kind of hot water? I'm not planning on moving home any time soon but I think it makes sense to take the exam sooner rather than later.
Thanks for your input.
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:34 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den You're not going to be in any hot water, but I'm sure it will raise a few eyebrows. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637454) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:36 AM Author: topaz useless brakes (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637473) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 6:26 PM Author: Clear theater stage How would they find out if you use your home address and don't ask the firm to pay your bar fees or tell them why you need a week off when you actually take the test?
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:22 AM Author: Rambunctious Cuckold How common are sexual relationships amongst your colleagues? I work in a large v50 in a tier 1 market and there are a couple of lawyer hawt fellow assocs whom I would like to sex, but have restrained myself for fear of the reputational consequences. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637406) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:32 AM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den A lot more common than most people think. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637445) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:35 AM Author: aquamarine razzmatazz heaven How often do you go on vacation?
What were things like before email? |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 9:24 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den A long vacation (week+)? Maybe once a year. I prefer short trips/vacations. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13660443) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 11:35 AM Author: ivory therapy jewess (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13637465) |
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Date: December 24th, 2009 6:24 PM Author: Clear theater stage What do you think is the better tactic, generally speaking? Why?
1. File class cert motion shortly after answer is filed without taking discovery from defendants 2. Spend several months doing pre-certification discovery and related motion practice
Of course an early cert motion is not always possible, but in some cases the prereqs are all there with public info. |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 9:26 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den As defense counsel, I'd much prefer it if you chose option 1. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13660460) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 10:06 PM Author: Clear theater stage Could you explain a little more?
Is it that corporate clients really hate discovery? I don't particularly like it either.
Sometimes the most I would gain from discovery is a few e-mails that make the D look bad, which only help get the class certified to the extent they inflame the judge against the defendant even if they'll be useful later.
Would you say the cost of discovery practice is so asymmetrical in favor of plaintiffs it is almost always worthwhile in increasing D's willingness to settle on reasonable terms? |
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Date: December 25th, 2009 3:12 AM Author: henna mother property If long hours are taking a serious toll on your personal life - divorce, kids are a mess - what is the appropriate way to bring this to a superior's attention? Is your only option to pack it up? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13642998) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 9:21 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den Depends on the situation I guess. What is your goal in telling someone? What are you hoping to achieve? If its just a slight decrease in hours/stress, it makes sense to raise it much sooner than divorce, kids are a mess. If you truly want to shift your priorities and focus on your families, then perhaps a career change might make sense. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13660414) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 11:59 PM Author: henna mother property The question was in the hypothetical, so you touched on all of my general concerns. Thank you. With that being said, from your experience, what would be the optimal timetable for <engagement --> marriage + honeymoon --> kids> when balancing hefty hours with a functioning family? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13662139) |
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Date: December 26th, 2009 1:28 AM Author: titillating elastic band On average, how many times a week do you suck cock? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13648182) |
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Date: December 26th, 2009 9:08 AM Author: exhilarant liquid oxygen I was set to start work for NY market salary and a $100,000 cost of living adjustment. I'm considering opting to do a JD/MBA. I have already been admitted to the program. It is a top 10 program. It'll cost $50,000 more in tuition and roughly $125,000 in lost wages. I'm having cold feet and wondering if I should just finish up my law degree without the MBA. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13648937) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 9:18 PM Author: buck-toothed trip rigor den I've never really understood the JD/MBA thing ... sounds like something only overachievers/strivers shoot for ... it has little benefit to the average practicing attorney. And that's in a normal/great economy. No idea why you'd give up so much to get one in this economy. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13660394) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 11:53 PM Author: Fragrant Shrine Associate i hate you so, so much for shutting me out of biglaw because i was lathamed. you know i was thrown out as a first year, right? there was very little work. many of us had no reviews. still, that's fatal to you.
i hope something very awful happens to you and your kind. you're abusing your power so it should be taken from you. i will fuck your kind over heartily if i ever have the chance, and believe me, i'm going to try my damndest to get that chance. |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 10:27 PM Author: Hyperactive iridescent temple I'm a first year litigation associate (technically a second year since I clerked, but whatever) at a top firm. I know my chances of making partner at the firm are minuscule. What should I be aiming to do next if my long term goal is to make partner somewhere else? Should I aim for a prestigious government job, like SDNY AUSA? Or should I just lateral to another firm?
Let me ask the same question in a different way. If your firm hired a midlevel or senior associate from one of the top firms, would you be likely to make them partner in a few years? Or would their chances be pretty low? Would the chances be higher if you hire someone who worked at a firm for about two years and then worked at something like SDNY AUSA (or the SEC, etc.) for a few years? |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 11:43 PM Author: dead location When hiring new associates how does your firm look upon UVA graduates? Am I crazy for choosing UVA over UM, NYU, and Penn if I want to work in the South or in DC? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13661949) |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 11:51 PM Author: Hyperactive iridescent temple Dude, UVA, Michigan, and Penn are all kind of interchangeable if you ignore regional advantages. That's why this board has the acronym "MVP". So don't hesitate to pick UVA over those schools.
Not as sure about how to advise you re: UVA v. NYU. |
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Date: December 27th, 2009 11:58 PM Author: disturbing laughsome school cafeteria how many blacks are in your office? So they usually stick around for a while? Are they treated the same? Do you guys go out of your way to hire them? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13662133) |
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Date: December 28th, 2009 12:53 AM Author: domesticated stage if a serial killer were to emerge who targeted only biglaw partners, no one would care. the cops probably wouldn't even investigate. how does that make you feel?
disclaimer: i am not the biglaw partner serial killer |
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Date: December 28th, 2009 7:16 AM Author: cowardly police squad azn I'm a 3L with an open NYC biglaw offer and an SDNY clerkship next year. I'm trying to decide whether to apply for COA clerkships for the following year. I want to be a litigator. Do you think it's more beneficial for me to take a second year to clerk or to go to the firm after my SDNY clerkship? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13664016) |
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Date: December 28th, 2009 7:22 AM Author: Fragrant Shrine Associate do the coa clerkship (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1172721&forum_id=2#13664018) |