Do we have too many law schools?
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Poast new message in this thread
Date: June 4th, 2006 5:11 PM Author: Fragrant Flirting Range Subject: From the other (actually countless other) thread
Absolutely not. The number of law schools is a function of our free market/supply and demand system. People say there are too many bc it lowers their prestige of calling themself a lawyer, but thats really just tough shit. Ambulance chasers are an important part of the system, its strange that the masses view them in such low regard.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908041) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:57 PM Author: dashing queen of the night
i think it's part cartel, part standards (at least from an historical explanation). but, i think fear of malpractice should be good enough to provide deterrence, even in the absence of the ABA and bar-accredidation; so these organizations probably are wasteful.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908353)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:18 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
All unaccredited, for-profit, and online/correspondance "law schools" are akin to trade schools like DeVry Institute.
All these TTTs and FTTs might as well give you a free toolbox at graduation.
Face it, degrees from most TTTs/FTTs are just not marketable. Attending these schools is an absolute waste of money, and it takes all the suckers who enroll a full 3 years to figure it out.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908079) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:44 PM Author: Fragrant Flirting Range
"and roughly half of the non-profit "traditional" law schools also need to go."
so youre basically saying every school up to and including Tulane is okay, but anything after that is questionable. thats good non-partisan logic
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908262) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:32 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
"3rd, 4th and 2nd tier schools all serve a useful purpose"
...to make money/enlarge endowments. Keep in mind I never belitted 2nd tier schools (which I believe, as you do...serve a "higher" purpose). I'm mostly referring to the 3rd/4th tier schools with sub-50% bar passage rates.
"the law as a profession isn't merely about biglaw"
Of course it's not, but there are more than enough folks at the Top 100 schools who don't go the biglaw route that can fill all the legal roles you've listed above (judges, defense attorneys, public interest, etc.)
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908179)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:40 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Of course there would. There are currently well over 1 MILLION licensed attorneys in the United States. That's roughly one out of every 250 people in the country.
Keeping in mind: (a) the average JD practicing law (in some form) practices until age 50, and (b) almost all law schools have more than 300 students (total), and some law schools have well over 1000 students...there would be a very healthy supply of attorneys to fill our country's legal needs if we just cut the amount of American law schools in half.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908231) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:51 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Imagine you're on trial for your life, who would you want to represent you?
Imagine you have to plan to acquire a new subsidiary corporation, and any wrong legal move can cost you tens of MILLIONS. Who would you want to represent you?
Imagine you are representing a man on trial for his life (bench trial), and all the facts and laws are on your side, but the prosecution has been playing to the court's sympathies for the entire trial. Who would you want on the bench?
If your answer to any of the above is a TTT/FTT over a 1st or 2nd tier graduate...you're just lying.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908319) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:59 PM Author: Yapping navy alpha quadroon
first, you didn't answer the question. it should have been obvious that you can't. that's what happens when you make retarded claims.
"If your answer to any of the above is a TTT/FTT over a 1st or 2nd tier graduate...you're just lying."
hmmm. it appears that the answer should be obvious, right? right. so if this is true, then i'm sure no big name corporate defendant would ever hire TTT counsel. and i'm sure no big name defendant accused of insider trading or securities fraud would ever hire someone from a school like . . . southwestern. right? right.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908362) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:00 PM Author: Slippery library crotch
it's not about what you WANT. instead, it's about what you can AFFORD.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908375)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:00 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Last I heard there were roughly 250 Million people in the US (granted, last time I even checked this number was a few years ago).
I know for a fact that there are over 1 Million licensed attorneys in America because every major legal magazine ran a story last year when the landmark 1 Millionth license was handed out.
You do the math.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908372) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:15 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
According to www.census.gov, there are currently 298,899,985 people in America.
At the very LEAST, the ratio of lawyers-to-American citizens is 1:300. Does that number work better for you?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908492) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:21 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
"Practicing" means "licensed", but not the other way around.
However, it would safe to assume that since the JD is a professional skills degree, that does not provide its holders with any special skills outside the legal field, that most people who are "licensed" make their living by "practicing" in some form or another.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908538)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:25 PM Author: Slippery library crotch
don't a lot of people leave the profession, due to dissatisfaction? it's likely that they would keep an active license, however, for any number of reasons.
we need to know how many "licensed" lawyers are actually practicing 1) full time, 2) p/t, 3)occasionally, 4)never
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908580) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:29 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
A lot of people leave Biglaw due to satisfaction, but not the profession as a whole. Many who can't stand firm life move on to government jobs, corporate in-house work, solo practice, etc. They still "practice", just in a different capacity.
Why do we need to know how many "licensed" lawyers are actually practicing?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908602) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:35 PM Author: Slippery library crotch
because you were claiming that we had too many lawyers. your support was the number of "licensed" lawyers. but "licensed" does not necessarily mean "available" for work.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908643)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:32 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Explain to me the logic in paying $150+K to attend a FTT or unaccredited law school, where the average graduate stands to make less than $35K upon graduation.
You might as well have just gotten a job out of college and worked your way up the ladder for 3 years.
The opportunity cost of attending most FTT's these days simply does not justify enrollment.
If a law school is not worth the tuition you pay to attend it...why keep it open?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908618) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:39 PM Author: Slippery library crotch Subject: and here's another reason
Perhaps as a result of competition for attorney positions, lawyers are increasingly finding work in nontraditional areas for which legal training is an asset, but not normally a requirement—for example, administrative, managerial, and business positions in banks, insurance firms, real estate companies, government agencies, and other organizations. Employment opportunities are expected to continue to arise in these organizations at a growing rate.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908679)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:45 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
That's right, there's always the chance they might strike gold as plaintiff's attorneys with a multi-million dollar tort suit against Big Oil or Big Tobacco.
Please do not attempt to argue that attending ANY law school, no matter how poor, is guaranteed to boost your lifetime earnings.
There are so many other types of grad/professional schools these folks could attend and stand to make more money in the long run.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908714) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:55 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Perhaps you misunderstood my response.
I said FTT's/unaccredited schools are not worth the price of tuition (since their graduates make so little upon graduation).
You responded by saying that salary at graduation =/= average lifetime salary...thereby suggesting that perhaps their FTT law degrees will pay off "in the long run" (read: over their lifetime, if not immediately upon graduation).
My response challenged that presumption, suggesting alternatively that the same folks who attend FTT's/non-ABA schools would likely be better of "in the long run" by pursuing a whole different career, rather than wasting 3 years of income-earning (and $150+K in loans) to attend such a subpar institution.
Is this more clear?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908779) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 7:03 PM Author: Yapping navy alpha quadroon
very bad reasoning. first, if we were to extend your latest ridiculous, badly thought out reasoning a bit, we'd come to the conclusion that everyone should pursue a career in medicine, because they'd likely be better off "in the long run" than if they chose a career in law. this conclusion is so inherently moronic that it defeats itself. perhaps an HLS grad, whose lifetime earnings per year would likely approach multiples of a hundred thousand, should pursue a career as a professional basketball player, because pro basketball players make millions a year, on average, and thus, a pro basketball career is better "in the long run" for HLS grads.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908838) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 7:12 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Wow, and you criticize me for thinking in black-and-white?
If you haven't gathered this fact yet, my posts speak in broad generalities.
Generally speaking, a graduate of a FTT/non-ABA school will ultimately regret their decision to attend (unless the title of "lawyer" is so self-gratifying that they will happily welcome unemployment/poverty to be called such by their friends and neighbors).
Perhaps I have known too many FTT's in my lifetime, or seen them begging for jobs on Craiglist too often...that I have arrived at my "poorly reasoned" conclusions. But they are my conclusions nonetheless. I simply don't see the need to perpetuate the creation of new law schools when so many competent and qualified JD's are unemployed/underemployed in this country.
If you wish to rebut this (or any other) post in this thread, please refer to my concession at the very bottom of the page.
Unfortunately, I have a brief due Tuesday which currently merits my attention.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908895) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:28 PM Author: Arousing Drunken Senate
<< (a) the average JD practicing law (in some form) practices until age 50 >>
Where are you getting that figure from? I've read that the average lawyer is 47 years old. That means it's possible, but highly unlikely, that the average lawyer also leaves law at 50.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908598) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:45 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Have you ever been to JDJive.com?
Spend a half hour reading threads there, and then tell me (honestly) that you don't think there are too many law schools in America.
When JD's (even decently qualified JD's) have to resort to paralegal jobs, clerical work, temp jobs, and contract doc review jobs...all just to make a living...it's a sign that the market is SATURATED with legal grads.
These new FTT's that are born every year or so (accepting students with sub-140 LSATS and sub-2.5 GPA's) are doing nothing more cashing in on all the hopes and dreams of complete dummies who grew up watching "The Practice" or "Ally McBeal" and are determined to become "lawyers" no matter what...even though, in reality, they don't have the intellect for it, and would likely make a better living in a different "skills" profession.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908268)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:06 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
"that still doesn't mean we should close that school, unless you're saying we should close down all schools whose graduates tend to face a tough job hunt"
There are some students in the T14 who face a tough job hunt (sad, but true).
There are many more who face a tough job hunt at schools ranked #15-#25.
And there are exponetially more students who face a tough job hunt as the schools fall below 30, 50, and 100...to the point where students attending unaccredited schools, online law schools, and rancid FTT's are virtually unemployable at graduation, regardless of their class rank.
Why do you wish to create so much competition among the lower-rungs of the profession?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908426) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:18 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Jesus christ, get off this Biglaw kick. I'm not so simpleminded as to think that big firm life is the only possible legal profession.
Believe it or not, some T14 students have problems finding ANY legal employmant AT ALL. Some T14 students NEVER PASS THE BAR.
Now if these few T14 folks, highly academically credentialed, cannot find any gainful employment...what do you think becomes of graduates of schools that are a dozen leagues or so behind the T14 (those with paltry entry-level requirements and bar pass rates)?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908517) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:32 PM Author: Yapping navy alpha quadroon
just in case it's not obvious yet, temporary unemployment (i.e., looking for a job at graduation) =/= unemployability.
"Believe it or not, some T14 students have problems finding ANY legal employmant AT ALL."
at worst, this is completely false. at best, it is meaningless, unless you define what "gainful" means.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908617) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:39 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
What I mean is that many JD's are forced to work in NON-LEGAL jobs as a product of being otherwise unemployable.
I know of quite a few JD's working for banks, department stores, and even a strip mall shoe store (none of them in a legal capacity) who all *wanted* to be lawyers at graduation but either: (a) couldn't pass the bar; or (b) passed the bar, but couldn't find a living wage as an attorney, and turned elsewhere to make their living.
If you really believe that any Top 100 law school grad can find a job as a lawyer if they simply *try* hard enough...you're far more naive than I.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908684) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:49 PM Author: Fragrant Flirting Range
By your claims, one would get the impression that 2/3 of the country has graduated law school.
"If you really believe that any Top 100 law school grad can find a job as a lawyer if they simply *try* hard enough...you're far more naive than I."
Of course not, plenty of idiots can try all day and still fail. Thats one of the few saving graces of the bar
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908742) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:17 PM Author: sapphire hateful volcanic crater Subject: JdJive
I'm a regular on JdJIve and have posted there off and on since I finished law school.
Jdjive is only one small message board. My attorney friends don't even know it exists (and if they do, they are amused by it and don't take any of the BS posted there that seriously).
For all we know, the posts are made by a minority of bitter and disgruntled unemployed law grads..and just need to vent on a public message board. For all we know, it could be 5 people who post 50 messages a day. You can't judge the entire legal profession based on 1 message board, for cripes sake, there is a thread with 200 messages about how Fordham Law is a toilet school...thats as bad as this board trashing schools in the Top 25 as 'toilets'. Give me a break.
I attended what many on this board would call a TT (NYC Tier 2) and turned out just fine job-wise. So did many of my classmates at the T2 and several others from SJU, Hofstra, NYLS and Pace. The ones who are whining on JdJive are the non-ABA grads who feel insecure about their employment chances or the bar retakers who feel the need to create alter egos to make it seem like the profession is worse than it is.
HTH.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908506)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:24 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Again, I never said anything about shutting down 2nd tier schools or schools like NYLS and Pace. But non-ABA law schools, for-profit law schools, and correspondance law schools appear to serve no purpose other than to increased the unemployed population of JD's.
They are simply not worth the cost of admission, and therefore, are more of a burden than a service-provider.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908560) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:49 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Not all of them, just those with horrendously low admissions standards and bar pass rates.
If you score below a 140 on an exam scored between 120-180, chances are not greatly in your favor that you will pass the Bar Exam (an exam of MINIMAL legal competence in most states).
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908737) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:46 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
The OP's idiotic argument goes the following:
1) high number of lawyers exist because there is a demand for TTT lawyers.
2) This demand is controlled by market force.
Assumption: Anything created by the market force is Good and should be tolerated.
Therefore, Ambulence chasers are good.
Something to this effect. The OP equates demand produced by market with being justified.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908276)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:07 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Not really. The ambulance chaser thing was further elaboration.
The main point was that we shouldn't cut down the number of law schools.
And the OP's evidence was the market force..oooooo
We don't need TTT lawyers.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908431) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:24 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
You are giving an extremely hypothetical situation where TTT attorneys disappear overnight.
The market structure will gradually change. Harvard students will have to take small cases. And by that time sole practice will not be looked down upon. They will still be called attorneys and highly respected.
When is the last time some one made fun of their local family physician just because he doesn't work at a big hospital?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908565) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:41 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Woah. Once again. you are in your hypothetical world. THINK!
By that time a HLS sole practioner will not make 35K. He will make way more since he will get many more cases.
I don't think you have any clue what solo practice is. You probably read shit on this board but that is probably it huh?
Instead of there being 20 local attorneys to call and price shop around, consumers will have only 2~3 lawyers in town.
So ..do the math. And trust me. 35K lawyers are 35K lawyers because they have time left over.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908694) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 7:10 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Yes. The prestige will go up.
Loyola solo practitioners rip people off. HLS student (with so much prestige) will have that conservative noble paternalistic mentality. He will treat his clients like his children.
Arent' you the one who said TTT loyola lawyers are making 35K? This would imply that some lawyers are not really getting enough cases. Why not cut down the number of lawyers and see if there are enough cases.
The negative connotation attached to "solo practice" will disappear.
PReSTIGE!
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908878) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:33 PM Author: titillating space fat ankles
3rd, 4th and 2nd tier schools all serve a useful purpose: the graduates of these schools become defense attorneys, ambulance chasers, corporate attorneys, judges, and public interest advocates.
judges? you've gotta be kidding me
public interest advocates? a lot of these people are highly credentialed. The failing grads who need money are working temp jobs.
I'm not going to continue. You're a moron.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908185) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:38 PM Author: Yapping navy alpha quadroon
"I'm not going to continue."
good idea.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908214) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:29 PM Author: cream pervert
My point is that not everything can be justified or explained simply in terms of supply and demand. Yes there is a supply of lawyers and a demand for lawyers, but the market for lawyers is vastly more complicated, and its impact more far-reaching, than the market for some meaningless material good.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908161)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:31 PM Author: Slippery library crotch
Employment of lawyers is expected to grow about as fast as average for all occupations through 2014, primarily as a result of growth in the population and in the general level of business activities. Job growth among lawyers also will result from increasing demand for legal services in such areas as health care, intellectual property, venture capital, energy, elder, antitrust, and environmental law.
In addition, the wider availability and affordability of legal clinics should result in increased use of legal services by middle-income people. However, growth in demand for lawyers will be limited as businesses, in an effort to reduce costs, increasingly use large accounting firms and paralegals to perform some of the same functions that lawyers do. For example, accounting firms may provide employee-benefit counseling, process documents, or handle various other services previously performed by a law firm. Also, mediation and dispute resolution increasingly are being used as alternatives to litigation.
Competition for job openings should continue to be keen because of the large number of students graduating from law school each year. Graduates with superior academic records from highly regarded law schools will have the best job opportunities.
Perhaps as a result of competition for attorney positions, lawyers are increasingly finding work in nontraditional areas for which legal training is an asset, but not normally a requirement—for example, administrative, managerial, and business positions in banks, insurance firms, real estate companies, government agencies, and other organizations. Employment opportunities are expected to continue to arise in these organizations at a growing rate.
As in the past, some graduates may have to accept positions in areas outside of their field of interest or for which they feel overqualified. Some recent law school graduates who have been unable to find permanent positions are turning to the growing number of temporary staffing firms that place attorneys in short-term jobs until they are able to secure full-time positions. This service allows companies to hire lawyers on an “as-needed” basis and permits beginning lawyers to develop practical skills while looking for permanent positions.
Because of the keen competition for jobs, a law graduate’s geographic mobility and work experience assume greater importance. The willingness to relocate may be an advantage in getting a job, but to be licensed in another State, a lawyer may have to take an additional State bar examination. In addition, employers are increasingly seeking graduates who have advanced law degrees and experience in a specialty, such as tax, patent, or admiralty law.
Employment growth for lawyers will continue to be concentrated in salaried jobs, as businesses and all levels of government employ a growing number of staff attorneys and as employment in the legal services industry grows. Most salaried positions are in urban areas where government agencies, law firms, and big corporations are concentrated. The number of self-employed lawyers is expected to decrease slowly, reflecting the difficulty of establishing a profitable new practice in the face of competition from larger, established law firms. Moreover, the growing complexity of law, which encourages specialization, along with the cost of maintaining up-to-date legal research materials, favors larger firms.
For lawyers who wish to work independently, establishing a new practice will probably be easiest in small towns and expanding suburban areas. In such communities, competition from larger, established law firms is likely to be less keen than in big cities, and new lawyers may find it easier to become known to potential clients.
Some lawyers are adversely affected by cyclical swings in the economy. During recessions, demand declines for some discretionary legal services, such as planning estates, drafting wills, and handling real estate transactions. Also, corporations are less likely to litigate cases when declining sales and profits result in budgetary restrictions. Some corporations and law firms will not hire new attorneys until business improves, and these establishments may even cut staff to contain costs. Several factors, however, mitigate the overall impact of recessions on lawyers; during recessions, for example, individuals and corporations face other legal problems, such as bankruptcies, foreclosures, and divorces requiring legal action.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908615)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:40 PM Author: Yapping navy alpha quadroon
"meaningless material good"
eh.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908229) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:43 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
You are being such an ignorant fool. Just stfu and kill self. The market can't explain why TTTs schools continue to produce unemployeed lawyers.
We as a society have a problem. And ambulence chasers do create their own demands (although this is un-econ way of thinking).
Ambulence chasers are not important part of the system. They create their own demand. It's is sort of like digging a hole and filling it up with sand again.
The ultimate question is: Is a market system that produce unnecessary ambulence chasers in itself problematic? yes. Can we fix that? Sure.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908254) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 5:51 PM Author: Fragrant Flirting Range
Its understandable why an ambulance chase would be hated by Warren Buffet or Hank Greenberg, but the average worker shouldnt mind them. they are much more likely to be a plaintiff.
Personal injury litigation improves the safety of products and decreases malpractice. Likewise, it opens a door to justice that would otherwise be unavailable to the poor. The fact that ambulance chasers do it for self-serving reasons is simply part of our free market society
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908318) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:23 PM Author: sapphire hateful volcanic crater Subject: from a defense attorneys perspective
"t would be just as plausible that it's little guy versus "mr chow's chicken shack". In this case, little guy gets massive settlement, and mr chow ( also a lttle guy) gets fucked."
Actually no. The little guy wil take home several thousand dollars as part of a global settlement, while the "Chicken Truck"'s insurance company will be writing out the check. Nothing will happen to the truck man, apart from a rise in premiums. It works like car insurance, the more risk you portray, the more you pay.....
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908556)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:34 PM Author: cream pervert
"apart from a rise in premiums"
Sounds like getting fucked to me.
Nor would this be an isolated incident, as every owner of a "chicken truck" type business would eventually have to pay higher premiums to compensate for the higher risk of litigation. The higher cost of running the business would push a certain amount of Mr chows out of the market, and little Chinny Chow would not have any food on her plate.
Why do you want little chinese girls to starve?
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908631) |
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Date: June 7th, 2006 8:28 PM Author: Fragrant Flirting Range
A) What one deserves from a given settlement is a
completely separate issue. You can have a reasonable
settlement without eliminating the lawsuit altogether.
B) While any outrageous settlement is one too many, it
stands to reason that such settlements are very rare.
Otherwise, you would see more 'prestigious' grads
doing personal injury. People sell out for a lot
less money and for a lot more questionable schemes than
suing a restaurant.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5933744)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:21 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Wow. A typical ambulance chaser mentality.
Don't you think there are better ways to inform possible victims than to allow TTT lawyers to file frivolous claims?
A devils advocate from a top laws chool is NOT highly regarded. I know that both sides are evil. The plaintiff's attorney files a stupid claim. The defense attorney talks shit on the plaintiff's attorney (calling him evil/douche/TTT/what not) but purposely drags the case for years with an intention of settling after few years. He has to milk the big companies before letting them go ;)
But...there are other ways than allowing this to go on.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908537)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:26 PM Author: Fragrant Flirting Range
"Don't you think there are better ways to inform possible victims than to allow TTT lawyers to file frivolous claims?"
Absolutely. But until the system is changed, they comprise a necessary evil. Limiting the supply of lawyers is not the way to change the system.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908584)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:11 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Dude. A frivolous defense does not HARM the society as much as a frivolous claim. Think about it. No I am not going to say it. Just think about it. It will help you when you start Vandy in the fall. There IS a big difference.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908461)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:33 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Nope.
have you heard of settlement? And some times the defendant can't ask for attorney's fee so the losing plaintiff does not have ANYthings pulling him back.
9/10 cases settle outside the court right?
Look, I understand where you are coming from. And I have issues with not only ambulance chasers but the evil big firms too. But frivolous claims are harmful.
How many times did you hear, "ewww.. you are gonna be a lawyer?....aren't there too many of them?"
IN OTHER COUNTRIES WHERE LAWYERS ARE REGARDED MORE PRESTIGIOUS THAN DOCTORS, you don't hear "ewww. lawyer?" You hear, "ohhh...I will let you fuck my daughter anyday sir."
For the sake of our prestige! For gods sake, we don't need TTT lawyers. Trust me.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908628) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:54 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Because of three reasons:
1) english is the only language I speak
2) I probably can't pass other countries ridiculous hard bar
3) I probably will make more money here.
don't you think asking me why I won't practice outside the US is childish? Come on. You know that's immature.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908777) |
Date: June 4th, 2006 5:20 PM Author: Ruby kitchen cuckoldry
we don't have enough law schools. firms are so desperate for lawyers they are willing to pay 145k to people with no experience. the ABA needs to get in gear and start accrediting more schools
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908089) |
Date: June 4th, 2006 5:46 PM Author: Irradiated territorial dysfunction theatre
To equalize supply and demand, the ABA should eliminate 22-100, T3, and T4.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908277) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 6:57 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Now THAT is going against the market force . We need more lawyers than that.
We don't need TTTs.
Good luck at vandy.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908799) |
Date: June 4th, 2006 6:14 PM Author: Diverse talking crackhouse internal respiration
yes, but it's a moot point, because aside from about 6 or 7 schools we won't have to come across people from the vast majority of law schools. well, you might. but i won't. hahahaha losers.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908485) |
Date: June 4th, 2006 6:25 PM Author: Arousing Drunken Senate
It depends what your goals are. If you have goals more like the public's goals, then there might not be enough law schools. If you have goals more like those of someone who is or will be going to a decent law school, then there are probably far too many law schools.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908575) |
Date: June 4th, 2006 7:05 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
Bull Connor, mirror, and J. Cohen win.
There are clearly not enough law schools in America, and so long as the market is willing to bear the creation of new law schools, everyone else should just deal with it.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908846)
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Date: June 4th, 2006 7:14 PM Author: Deranged forum sweet tailpipe
You can handle these folks, somatic. Regrettably, I have a brief to write this evening and cannot pursue this argument any further.
God speed in fighting the good fight.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5908909) |
Date: June 4th, 2006 9:58 PM Author: lake hell trust fund
why do you faggots care if some crappy lawyers will never get jobs? It's none of your concern. There's no need to regulate how many law schools because people can't practice unless they pass the bar. But in any case, allowing more lawyers is never a matter of life and death. At least for doctors, allowing more doctors could literally be a matter of life or death because of the nature of their profession. All the talk about the drain on society is stupid bullshit, but if for some reason it's necessary to reduce the number of lawyers, it makes more sense to make the bar more difficult than pick and choose which schools should choose
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5910067) |
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Date: June 4th, 2006 10:28 PM Author: provocative dingle berry dilemma
Bar in US=joke
TTT attorneys=damaging general prestige of REAL attorneys.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5910312) |
Date: June 7th, 2006 7:55 PM Author: Know-it-all boyish lay
anyone who thinks we should shut down T3 and T4 schools has obviously never been bitten by their neighbor's dog, had trouble getting a security deposit back from a landlord, or been sold a lemon by a used car salesman.
This isn't mocking. Day to day shit like that happens ALLLLLLLL time time and a TTT lawyer is still 1000 times better equipped to deal with it than a non-lawyer.
(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=427849&forum_id=2#5933516)
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