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Empire State jumper worked in toilet law

Your jdjive nightmare come to life: Date: April 13th...
indigo flirting theater
  04/14/07
Why do lawyers tolerate $35k salaries?
cracking hideous hall volcanic crater
  04/14/07
ha! You think they have a choice?
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
I just posted a bunch of choices.
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
those 45-50k a year jobs dont look any better when you have ...
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
$35k is less than $45k, isn't it? You do believe in math, r...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
10k basically makes no difference when you live in NYC and h...
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
$45k is 22.5% more after taxes. Assuming $700/month loan ...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
700 a month seems rather low (I would think its more like 1k...
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
Going from $600/month to $1000/month for housing is a big ju...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
not in NYC where both numbers are basically laughable.
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
You're being deliberately fucktarded. I'm done.
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
I lol'd at this exchange, ty
Nighttime claret mother meetinghouse
  04/14/07
what can you rent in NYC for 600? A basement in queens maybe...
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
WHEN DO YOU THINK THEY'LL FINISH DRAWING UP THE COMPLAINT AG...
cerebral gold trust fund library
  04/14/07
http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/tch/311498143.html Exte...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/tch/310772016.html Stoc...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/ofc/310079414.html EXEC...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/ret/310471164.html Ente...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/bus/310649631.html IHOP...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
Wait a minute, there's an IHOP in Morningside?
Snowy bespoke skinny woman
  04/14/07
IHOP > law
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
I had no idea there were any in NYC. Good to know.
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
Well, apparently there's one near Penn (which I can't recall...
Snowy bespoke skinny woman
  04/14/07
This would have been a good position for him; he made a pret...
Dashing Stead Doctorate
  04/14/07
oh jesus
Startled Bateful Regret
  04/14/07
Underappreciated post.
learning disabled laser beams
  04/14/07
180
Talking Concupiscible Circlehead Parlour
  04/14/07
could this in fact, be the DEFINITIVE XOXO post???
Titillating mad cow disease rigor
  04/15/07
Well played.
cracking hideous hall volcanic crater
  04/15/07
...
mauve underhanded friendly grandma
  04/15/07
http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/lgl/309015054.html Lega...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/etc/307857846.html Dog ...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
WOW this is the nightmare scenario for every LS grad.... ...
Plum soul-stirring sanctuary
  04/14/07
plop plop outted?
bearded mischievous internal respiration
  04/14/07
178.
Fishy tanning salon
  04/14/07
Cardozo isn't even a true TTT either. The thought of incurr...
Metal Wine Location
  04/14/07
Well, it's possible this guy had some issues. I mean, he di...
Snowy bespoke skinny woman
  04/14/07
...
vivacious affirmative action boistinker
  04/14/07
What I mean is the reason he could only get a job paying $35...
Snowy bespoke skinny woman
  04/14/07
"you realize the chances he posted here are about 99.98...
Dull exciting pisswyrm pervert
  04/14/07
His student debt dies with him, right? I wonder if he was...
magenta well-lubricated love of her life
  04/14/07
Suicide is for pussies. He should have concocted a devious ...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
Might as well die in a hail of police gunfire after robbing ...
arrogant rigpig
  04/14/07
That's cool, too.
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
but then you wouldnt pity him. Now the state bar and ABA wil...
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
He should have faked his own death and then gotten a new ide...
Swashbuckling yarmulke
  04/14/07
What are the best ways to fake your own death?
cracking hideous hall volcanic crater
  04/15/07
if he had a co-signor the co-signor is stuck I think.
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
Death Discharge Cancellation because of the borrower's deat...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
what about private loans?
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
If it's not government backed, you have to read the contract...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
Most lenders do not discharge loan balances for any reason. ...
translucent spectacular selfie national
  04/14/07
That explains why he jumped out of a 69th floor window. He ...
Dashing Stead Doctorate
  04/14/07
This is my immediate future.
slimy garrison tank
  04/14/07
even retards can find better jobs than this in government. G...
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
but I don't want to live outside of NYC. That's the only pl...
slimy garrison tank
  04/14/07
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2kocOsqzFU
slap-happy hilarious rehab
  04/14/07
rats, overcrowded shitbox apartments, lawyers literally kill...
Kink-friendly cuckold black woman
  04/14/07
Bed bugs, too. Seriously, what shit hole has bed bugs?
cracking hideous hall volcanic crater
  04/15/07
The correct terminology is SHITLAW.
Zombie-like Abode Gaping
  04/14/07
You mean SPLATLAW.
Dull exciting pisswyrm pervert
  04/15/07
...
Zombie-like Abode Gaping
  04/15/07


Poast new message in this thread





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:17 AM
Author: indigo flirting theater

Your jdjive nightmare come to life:

Date: April 13th, 2007 9:55 PM

Author: Hazelrah (http://xoxoreader.blogspot.com/)

"Police identified the man as Moshe Kanovsky, a lawyer in his 30s."

I looked him up in Martindale and all it says is "private practice lawyer."

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612723&forum_id=2#7927819)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: April 13th, 2007 10:08 PM

Author: Kara Thrace (Adah)

He passed the NYS bar in February 2003. That's all I found through Google.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612723&forum_id=2#7927900)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: April 13th, 2007 10:40 PM

Author: Community Norm

Registration Number: 4157673

MOSHE M. KANOVSKY

LAWRENCE, KRAUSE & ASSOCIATES, P.C.

67 WALL ST STE 1701

NEW YORK, NY 10005-3124

United States

(212) 269-7000

Year Admitted in NY: 2003

Appellate Division Department of Admission: 2

Law School: CARDOZO LAW SCHOOL

Registration Status: Due to reregister within 30 days of birthday

Next Registration: Apr 2007

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612723&forum_id=2#7928098)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: April 13th, 2007 10:48 PM

Author: Community Norm

Subject: ofmg -- toilet lawyer kills self.

Attorney: Krause & Associates, 67 Wall Street, New York, NY 10005. Plaintiff personal injury firm, $35,000. Cover letter, resume and writing sample by email to Avril Winchester at krauselaw@hotmail.com And Lawrence Krause at krause@lawyer.com. Telephone 212 269-7000.

http://www.law.cuny.edu/OurResources/careersvcs/dec1503.html

[last updated at 12/09/03 3:26 PM]

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612723&forum_id=2#7928157)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: April 13th, 2007 11:15 PM

Author: valen2

he was a strong dude for lasting that long.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612723&forum_id=2#7928344)



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928766)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:20 AM
Author: cracking hideous hall volcanic crater

Why do lawyers tolerate $35k salaries?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928780)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:06 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

ha! You think they have a choice?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929096)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:13 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

I just posted a bunch of choices.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929133)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:17 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

those 45-50k a year jobs dont look any better when you have 120k in debt I'd imagine.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929153)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:20 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

$35k is less than $45k, isn't it? You do believe in math, right?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929166)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:21 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

10k basically makes no difference when you live in NYC and have debt like that. All it means is that you can afford to go to McDonalds a few more times a week.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929178)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:35 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

$45k is 22.5% more after taxes.

Assuming $700/month loan payments, that's 36% more money after taxes and the loan.

That's not small.

$6000/year is more than McDonald's money.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929250)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:40 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

700 a month seems rather low (I would think its more like 1k thanks to private loans), but whatever. 6k in NYC buys basically nothing. It means you have no hope of ever owning a home/apartment in the city or even renting a decent 2 bedroom outside of the ghetto. You cant even send 1 kid to private school on 6k.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929263)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:47 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

Going from $600/month to $1000/month for housing is a big jump.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929302)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:50 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

not in NYC where both numbers are basically laughable.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929336)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:51 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

You're being deliberately fucktarded. I'm done.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929344)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:55 AM
Author: Nighttime claret mother meetinghouse

I lol'd at this exchange, ty

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929373)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:56 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

what can you rent in NYC for 600? A basement in queens maybe, but probably NOTHING. You would almost certainly be looking for roomates.

For 1k you can move up to a 1 bedroom in the ghetto. My parents rented out a 1 bedroom a few months ago for 1200 next to the Marlboro projects in Brooklyn. 570sq feet of shit.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929377)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:47 AM
Author: cerebral gold trust fund library

WHEN DO YOU THINK THEY'LL FINISH DRAWING UP THE COMPLAINT AGAINST THE TOILET FIRM THAT KILLED HIM?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929639)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:31 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

http://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/tch/311498143.html

Exterminator $35,000 - $40,000 12Hr Shifts = $90,000



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928850)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:32 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/tch/310772016.html

Stock Clerk $12Hr L.I. - Shipping Supervisor $40-50,000 to $70,000 with 12Hr Shifts Advance to Warehouse Mgr. $100K by JFK



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928855)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:33 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/ofc/310079414.html

EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT, Investment Fund (up to $85K+Bonus+Great Benefits)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928866)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:36 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/ret/310471164.html

Enterprise Rent-A-Car Management Trainee Progr

Compensation: 32,500-35,000 the first year.



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928888)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:39 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/bus/310649631.html

IHOP Manager (Harlem / Morningside)

Compensation: $37,000 - $45,000 plus Bonus



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928920)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:57 AM
Author: Snowy bespoke skinny woman

Wait a minute, there's an IHOP in Morningside?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929056)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:59 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

IHOP > law

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929065)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:07 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

I had no idea there were any in NYC. Good to know.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929102)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:15 AM
Author: Snowy bespoke skinny woman

Well, apparently there's one near Penn (which I can't recall ever seeing) and then this one, which is at like 135th and 7th avenue.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929145)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:30 AM
Author: Dashing Stead Doctorate

This would have been a good position for him; he made a pretty spectacular pancake.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929538)





Date: April 14th, 2007 4:45 AM
Author: Startled Bateful Regret

oh jesus

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929898)





Date: April 14th, 2007 4:52 AM
Author: learning disabled laser beams

Underappreciated post.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929902)





Date: April 14th, 2007 10:35 AM
Author: Talking Concupiscible Circlehead Parlour

180

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7930004)





Date: April 15th, 2007 12:22 AM
Author: Titillating mad cow disease rigor

could this in fact, be the DEFINITIVE XOXO post???



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7933775)





Date: April 15th, 2007 1:37 AM
Author: cracking hideous hall volcanic crater

Well played.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7934215)





Date: April 15th, 2007 1:43 AM
Author: mauve underhanded friendly grandma



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7934244)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:40 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

http://newyork.craigslist.org/mnh/lgl/309015054.html

Legal Secretary (Midtown East)

Compensation: 45-58K



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928928)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:42 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

http://newyork.craigslist.org/lgi/etc/307857846.html

Dog walker

$15 to $20 per hour

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928947)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:28 AM
Author: Plum soul-stirring sanctuary

WOW

this is the nightmare scenario for every LS grad.... graduate from a TTT with shit grades, get a horrible job and end up killing self.

except he quite literally killed self.

you realize the chances he posted here are about 99.98% right?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928827)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:29 AM
Author: bearded mischievous internal respiration

plop plop outted?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928834)





Date: April 14th, 2007 8:00 PM
Author: Fishy tanning salon

178.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7932271)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:14 AM
Author: Metal Wine Location

Cardozo isn't even a true TTT either. The thought of incurring $100K+ in debt and pulling a starting salary of $35k is horrifying.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929140)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:21 AM
Author: Snowy bespoke skinny woman

Well, it's possible this guy had some issues. I mean, he did just throw himself out of a 69th-story window.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929177)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:02 AM
Author: vivacious affirmative action boistinker



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929406)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:10 AM
Author: Snowy bespoke skinny woman

What I mean is the reason he could only get a job paying $35K might have been that he had of some kind of personality disorder.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929450)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:36 AM
Author: Dull exciting pisswyrm pervert

"you realize the chances he posted here are about 99.98% right?"

This guy redefines "outted".

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929576)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:42 AM
Author: magenta well-lubricated love of her life

His student debt dies with him, right?

I wonder if he was in a financial position where he was so deeply in debt and able to command such a low salary in the open market that his suicide made financial sense for his family and himself. How awful.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928950)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:44 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

Suicide is for pussies. He should have concocted a devious plan to eliminate his debt (if that's the reason). If he fails, then he can hop out the window.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7928961)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:48 AM
Author: arrogant rigpig

Might as well die in a hail of police gunfire after robbing a few banks rather than jumping out a window.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929003)





Date: April 14th, 2007 12:52 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

That's cool, too.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929035)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:10 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

but then you wouldnt pity him. Now the state bar and ABA will hold a bunch of stupid conferences and meetings and shit where NOTHING will be decided and of course NOTHING will change and the ABA will of oourse continue to accredit more and more TTT schools.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929116)





Date: April 14th, 2007 5:28 AM
Author: Swashbuckling yarmulke

He should have faked his own death and then gotten a new identity illegal-alien style.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929916)





Date: April 15th, 2007 1:38 AM
Author: cracking hideous hall volcanic crater

What are the best ways to fake your own death?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7934221)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:11 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

if he had a co-signor the co-signor is stuck I think.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929119)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:19 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

Death Discharge

Cancellation because of the borrower's death (or, in the case of PLUS Loans, the death of the student for whom the parent borrowed) is based on an original or certified copy of the death certificate submitted to the school (for a Federal Perkins Loan) or to the holder of the loan (for a FFEL or Direct Stafford Loan).

http://www.studentaid.ed.gov/PORTALSWebApp/students/english/discharges.jsp?tab=repaying

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929162)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:23 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

what about private loans?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929184)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:38 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

If it's not government backed, you have to read the contract.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929260)





Date: April 14th, 2007 1:41 AM
Author: translucent spectacular selfie national

Most lenders do not discharge loan balances for any reason. If the borrower dies, some lenders will pursue the borrower’s estate to satisfy the debt. A cosigner, if any, may be responsible for the repayment of the loan obligation even in the event of the borrower’s death.

http://www.iowacollegeaid.org/faa/bulletin/Direct_Grad_PLUS_vs_Private062306.pdf

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929267)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:32 AM
Author: Dashing Stead Doctorate

That explains why he jumped out of a 69th floor window. He couldn't afford a ticket to the observation deck.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929544)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:42 AM
Author: slimy garrison tank

This is my immediate future.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929608)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:43 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

even retards can find better jobs than this in government. Go ding peoples SSI applications.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929617)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:45 AM
Author: slimy garrison tank

but I don't want to live outside of NYC. That's the only place civilized enough for me

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929627)





Date: April 14th, 2007 2:47 AM
Author: slap-happy hilarious rehab

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-2kocOsqzFU

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929641)





Date: April 14th, 2007 11:15 AM
Author: Kink-friendly cuckold black woman

rats, overcrowded shitbox apartments, lawyers literally killing self...awsome

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7930056)





Date: April 15th, 2007 1:39 AM
Author: cracking hideous hall volcanic crater

Bed bugs, too.

Seriously, what shit hole has bed bugs?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7934226)





Date: April 14th, 2007 7:03 AM
Author: Zombie-like Abode Gaping

The correct terminology is SHITLAW.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7929919)





Date: April 15th, 2007 12:24 AM
Author: Dull exciting pisswyrm pervert

You mean SPLATLAW.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7933786)





Date: April 15th, 2007 12:36 AM
Author: Zombie-like Abode Gaping



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=612983&forum_id=2#7933910)