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Why the fuck do libs think that EVERYONE should have health care
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:27 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw in an unlimited amount, and free to the extent that they don't have money/would rather buy other things with their limited funds?
You can get better health care today by reading the Mayo clinic website than the best health care 50 years ago. So things are pretty good overall.
But no, everyone must have everything and it must be forced upon everyone. I don't like where technology and statism are taking us. We are going to be slaves.
EDIT: Libs please answer this hypo: What if we invented something tomorrow that cures everything and makes sure we all live to 90 but it costs $20 million per person. Please tell me what should be done in this situation. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:28 AM Author: zombie-like french chef abode We are warm blooded--we actually care about all Americans, unlike that reptilian race that only cares about perpetuating gross concentrations of wealth and glaring disparities in wealth distribution. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982553) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:34 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw Do you think it would be better if we could make it so that everyone was poor, so that things would be equal? This is a serious question. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982572) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:38 AM Author: zombie-like french chef abode You sound dumb asking this question. As a policy matter, would that make sense? No. As a political proposition, likewise. Think logically and cogently, brother. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982579) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:41 AM Author: sinister turdskin LOL, a shitlib whose policy position is based on being a warm blooded guy who just REALLY REALLY cares about his neighbors demands logical cogency.
Touche brother, touche. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:42 AM Author: zombie-like french chef abode Aren't you being a bit reductionist, brother? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982597) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:43 AM Author: insane flushed masturbator retarded (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982599) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:44 AM Author: zombie-like french chef abode (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982601) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:58 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw No answer? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982657) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 2:03 PM Author: violent turquoise new version It's a legitimate question. Would you rather the poor be poorer in the long-run, but we're more equal? It's basic economics, and you've shown your economic illiteracy. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20984084) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 12:59 PM Author: Copper Rehab Depressive Your premise is incorrect. Everything you reasoned based off of that premise is invalid. Maybe you should read what the ACA is from somewhere other than Fox News? Because the pitfalls of the position you're describing are, in fact, the pitfalls of the REPUBLICAN platform.
Recall, if you will, when Obama brought the "unlimited amount" problem into the public discussion. He was accused of instituting death panels by the Republican nominee for Vice President. |
Date: June 29th, 2012 9:29 AM Author: sinister turdskin because they WANT it bro. they NEEEEEEEEEEEED it. libs regularly confuse satisfaction with fairness. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982554) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:29 AM Author: dashing chapel love of her life What if they're satisfied by fairness? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982560) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:34 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw Do you think it would be better if we could make everyone poor so that things would be equal? This is a serious question. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982570) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:15 AM Author: dashing chapel love of her life No.
Do you think this country would be better if we let segments of American society fall to abysmal levels of poverty, e.g. India, Sub-saharan Africa?
Also a serious question. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 2:01 PM Author: violent turquoise new version Link? All I see are YouTube videos of American poors rioting to pay $300 Nikes. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20984074) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 2:05 PM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw Cp (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20984104) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 2:06 PM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw I asked first. You answer, then I will. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20984106) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:37 AM Author: sinister turdskin oh they are, provided that fairness includes a high level of access to all the resources they WANT and NEED regardless of the cost of providing that access and also of who foots the bill. just so long as they get their shit, everything will be just fine. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982577) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:42 AM Author: insane flushed masturbator yeah well they think fair is one thing, you think its another (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982595) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:59 AM Author: sinister turdskin so we should let whoever can muster 51% of the votes decide, and damn the 49% in the minority, right brother? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982666) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:02 AM Author: insane flushed masturbator one could interpret democracy that way (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982678) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:03 AM Author: sinister turdskin do you think we live in a democracy?
would you actually want to live in a democracy?
did you fail 7th grade civics? |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:13 AM Author: insane flushed masturbator sure (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982730) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:29 AM Author: dashing chapel love of her life Because we all have health. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982557) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:29 AM Author: insane flushed masturbator cause theyre not barbaric (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982558) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:32 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw What if we invented something tomorrow that cures everything and makes sure we all live to 90 but it costs $20 million per person. Please tell me what should be done in this situation. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982565) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:40 AM Author: insane flushed masturbator SLIPPERY SLOPE (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982589) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:57 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw Just answer the hypo. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982655) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:02 AM Author: insane flushed masturbator it's a retarded hypo (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982681) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:32 AM Author: Bearded whorehouse Says a shitlib who likely paraded the "WHAT IF TRAYVON WAS WHITE!?" hypo (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982830) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:35 AM Author: insane flushed masturbator thats an assumption ur retarded hypo is in evidence here (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982839) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:37 AM Author: Bearded whorehouse Non-responsive. Also, not my hypo (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982841) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:17 AM Author: dashing chapel love of her life Everyone should get it. Productivity boon to the economy would be worth it. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982754) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:38 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parable_of_the_broken_window (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982846) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:29 AM Author: Low-t razzle-dazzle water buffalo field Cause Jesus said we should (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982559) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:44 AM Author: Vivacious house Do you think that we should let people die in tbe streets if they cant afford tbe er? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982600) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:48 AM Author: Sable learning disabled wagecucks Yes, because poor ppl are often denied health service in the ER. solid point bro. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982621) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:16 AM Author: dashing chapel love of her life OP's arguing that they should be. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982745) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 11:24 AM Author: lascivious mother nibblets (Purposely obtuse schtick) (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20983038) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:46 AM Author: Ebony Boiling Water serious question: Where in the health care bill does it cover viagra?
I was talking to my friend, and I used the "boomers booking tickets to Punta Cana with a briefcase full of Viagra." And, he asked if the health care bill covered viagra. I said, "I think so, but I am not sure." Does anyone have a credible source that states the health care bill covers viagra? I did google searches, but I keep on getting some amendment to keep criminals from getting it. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:50 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw This wouldn't be specifically addressed by the bill itself, but yes it will cover Viagara in practice, unless of course the agencies determining the rules go against big pharma!! LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL obamacare is one big handout to pharma, insurance cos, etc. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982625) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:13 AM Author: Ebony Boiling Water Ok. got it. Thanks for the information. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982732) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:46 AM Author: Hilarious Deranged Generalized Bond Stock Car There's a strong argument that providing a base level of care for all improves the country's economy and people's happiness/satisfaction. Every industrialized nation, including free-market paradises like Hong Kong and Singapore, recognize the value in guarantying care for all. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982613) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:48 AM Author: Translucent Marvelous Lay (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982620) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:50 AM Author: zombie-like french chef abode finally some logical cogency ITT (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982624) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:52 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw Base level as in ER care?
With obamacare, "base level" = very fucking expensive and comprehensive |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:52 AM Author: zombie-like french chef abode He is giving us subsidies. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982636) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:00 AM Author: sinister turdskin ROFL holy shit at "giving" (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982671) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:00 AM Author: Hilarious Deranged Generalized Bond Stock Car We all pay for it one way or another and the current system is by far the most expensive in the industrialized world and the results are not exactly anything to cheer about. If you have a more efficient way of providing healthcare please tell us. Obamacare borrows from what other industrialized countries have done to keep costs down while still delivering good care to everyone.
There was a great story a few years back of a wealthy European industrialist who tried to open a factory somewhere in the South. He laughed at the notion that somehow the US was a great tax haven for "job creators." He pointed out that while he had a property tax abatement and enjoyed a low effective corporate tax rate, healthcare costs were essentially a 25% tax. Maybe if we looked at healthcare costs as a giant tax reptiles would finally get off their asses and recognize the gravity of the problem. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:03 AM Author: Translucent Marvelous Lay (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982685) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:07 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw Ge this through your thick fucking skull:
Obamacare does not keep costs down. Obamacare does not keep costs down. It does absolutely nothing to keep costs down. It takes the current system, and it keeps every single one of its terrible features and even makes them worse. It gets everyone covered, which is nice. But it takes a bad system, keeps the bad parts and makes them worse, and brings everyone in on it along with major subsidies to make sure that we have enough money to keep making things worse.
Switzerland spends 10.8% of GDP on health care compared to our 17%. What do they do right? Well, 33% of their spending is out of pocket. That means there is a market for services and people actually care about cost. In comparison, we spend 12% out of pocket. Big difference.
It's nice that everyone is covered. It's nice that olds and poors have to pay less, not so nice that working young people have to pay for that directly. But one thing Obamacare does not do is address the cost issue. It makes it worse. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:10 AM Author: Hilarious Deranged Generalized Bond Stock Car lol you mention Switzerland. Obamacare is actually quite similar to Switzerland's mandate. I'm sure there are many constructive criticisms that can be made of Obamacare, however, the GOP simply hates the idea of a mandate and appears content to keep the current system in place. That's not a solution. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982719) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:12 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw No. I'm not even opposed to a mandate in theory. It's everything else that goes along with Obamacare that makes it horrible. And, in this country, I'm not sure I can trust our government with the power of a mandate and with good market-based reforms I think we could sufficiently solve things without a mandate.
The important point here is that OBAMACARE DOES NOT KEEP COSTS DOWN. Get that into your libtarded brain. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:15 AM Author: Translucent Marvelous Lay What's 'everything else that goes along with obamacare'
DESCRIBE, if you would. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:17 AM Author: Rebellious Hell Old Irish Cottage 80/20, per illness vs. per treatment, etc. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982755) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:20 AM Author: Translucent Marvelous Lay If you could design a universal healthcare system, CGM, which country's model would you base it off of? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982771) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:26 AM Author: Rebellious Hell Old Irish Cottage I wouldnt, I couldnt, nobody can. Why do you think there are thousands of different types of bread? There are 300M INDIVIDUALS in this country, you cannot formulate a system that is tailored to each of their different needs and priorities. Only a free-market operating on a voluntary basis can provide that sort of individualized service. Moreover, nobody spends someone else's money as well as their own. The moment you have a system where the users and payers are separated, prices skyrocket and quality stagnates. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982807) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:30 AM Author: Translucent Marvelous Lay What do you think about countries that offer universal care extremely efficiently like Switzerland or Singapore? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982822) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:35 AM Author: Rebellious Hell Old Irish Cottage A) I don't know what you mean by "extremely efficient" that implies some objective value metric for determining HC expenditure. Newsflash: There is none. Is keeping an 80 year-old alive for 2 more year worth $1? $10K? $100K? Where does it become inefficient?
B) What other countries implement cannot in a million years be expected to have the same effects there as it would here.
For example;
1. Show me official statistics of the annual percentage of malpractice lawsuits in USA vs. Switzerland. (I wonder if the Swiss have as many as we have here, including the frivolous ones that still cost money).
2. How about statistics of obesity in America vs. Switzerland.
3. As of 2008 Switzerland is No. 7 in the top of the least govt. corruption. USA is shown as No. 17 and falling. Corruption leads to fraud. Fraud and unaccountability lead to massive loss of money, money that the tax payers have to pay, just so that the "chunky" bureaucrats don't have to lower their standard of living.
4. How about statistics of how many "parasites" does Switzerland have compared to America? You know, those that are able to but do not want to work, are not productive in the society, and don't pay into the system yet they benefit from it. I would want the editor to look me up in the eyes and dare to tell me that Switzerland has as many welfare and section 8 housing dependents as America has.
5. How about heart attacks, strokes, and other high risk conditions that are the result of a sedentary and poor lifestyle? How is it in both countries and how it compares from one to another?
6. How many illegals do they have in Switzerland that are covered under the system?
(c/p) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:46 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw credited post (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982876) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 4:05 PM Author: lascivious mother nibblets As a shitlib, I REALLY want someone to respond to this, cuz I can't. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20984869) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:24 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw -insurance tied to employment -mandatory comprehensive coverage (no out of pocket spending, no selection of coverages) -socialization of insurance premiums (not enough ability to adjust for risk profile e.g. age, obesity) -no artificial cost control mechanisms (not a free marketeers favorite thing but some could be appropriate here) -too much welfare for "poors" -lack of a huge variety of possible reforms to lower health care costs mainly focusing on competition/markets (mandatory open IP licensing, expanded HSAs, moderate tort reform, busting of monopolistic regulatory/licensing/certification crap, billing models, increased transparency in pricing and services, etc etc) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 12:24 PM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20983408) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:03 AM Author: Translucent Marvelous Lay ER care is not base level, and it's extremely expensive and inefficient compared to preventative measures like regular checkups. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982682) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:10 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw ER care is expensive because hospitals get away with issuing huge bills for it. No other reason.
Preventative measures are severely overrated, just a lib talking point. Get your breast exam. Get your prostate exam. Not much more to it than that. Preventative care does not affect your bronchitis or your broken leg. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:19 AM Author: Translucent Marvelous Lay Maybe not a broken leg, but it's less expensive to have a doctor to go to for minor antibiotics or antivirals when you have bronchitis than it is to go to the ER for surgery because you're about to lose a lung because you never saw a doctor and that bronchitis was actually caused by Tuberculosis that could end up killing you. How is that not an example of how preventative care is less expensive. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982764) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:21 AM Author: onyx disturbing sanctuary dopamine preventative medicine is actually not cost effective in many cases. giving people statins, for example, will often reduce mortality but increase costs. this type of preventive care shouldn't be available to everyone. the purpose of health care reform should be reducing the economic burden of the lower class on the rest of us (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982776) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 2:05 PM Author: violent turquoise new version In Singapore and Hong Kong, people actually pay the majority of their healthcare costs out-of-pocket. Libs would be irate over non-rich people doing this. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20984102) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 9:57 AM Author: Gold Charismatic Ratface Bbw (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982653) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:04 AM Author: slimy motley place of business fortuitous meteor I think universal health care would be fine and dandy if not for the insanity of trying to implement it efficiently. That sounds like a nightmare.
The current system is also a nightmare, but I wonder if we were to actually pull the trigger on a real universal health care plan -- how long it would even take to get it up and running? |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:24 AM Author: contagious orchestra pit doctorate The biggest obstacle to universal health care is that no one will accept a coverage option that provides shitty care. Brits and other countries with a history of classism are willing to put up with awful care at the bottom end -- long waits, terrible doctors, etc. -- but every diabetic are country tard in the United States will get MAF if they don't get cadillac care when heart disease or lung cancer rears its head.
I'm all for a super cheap public option that caps coverage and doesn't let you get every high end treatment just to prolong life a few more miserable years. Just keep it simple, force people to make tough choices, and if it means poors can't have the same fancy treatments, then so be it. |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:26 AM Author: onyx disturbing sanctuary dopamine this is the most reasonable way of going about things. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982805) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:31 AM Author: blue seedy pervert milk Agreed. A tiered system is required, with the option of buying superior insurance or paying out-of-pocket on top of gov't-provided "free" care. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982828) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 10:32 AM Author: beady-eyed offensive gay wizard cr (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20982831) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 12:29 PM Author: sinister turdskin Death panels. My kingdom for a death panel. (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20983446) |
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Date: June 29th, 2012 3:44 PM Author: onyx disturbing sanctuary dopamine Libs - what are your feelings on giving shit care to poors? (http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=1982505&forum_id=2#20984709) |