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Blizzard employees revolt over not receiving >10% pay raises (ink)

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-08-03/blizzard-...
cracking peach laser beams center
  08/11/20
One employee wrote that they had to skip meals to pay rent a...
Jet tripping liquid oxygen feces
  08/11/20
another scammed reddit for free pizza
yapping lascivious business firm mexican
  08/11/20
...
Talented bistre den kitty
  08/11/20
...
Sticky sex offender mental disorder
  08/11/20
Sounds like they have lavish lifestyles
cracking peach laser beams center
  08/11/20
*TMF adding cost of shitty free coffee to their total HHI* *...
cordovan ticket booth organic girlfriend
  08/11/20
lol you beat me to the "all in" joke
Walnut crusty keepsake machete
  08/11/20
...
scarlet shrine headpube
  08/11/20
...
excitant multi-billionaire
  08/11/20
I been following this story (i'm a big MMO-mo though I don't...
Curious principal's office karate
  08/11/20
Lmfao at in game membership time being an employment perk jf...
Zombie-like useless brakes
  08/11/20
One guy posted that he has 25 years of WoW subscription. T...
Curious principal's office karate
  08/11/20
...
Zombie-like useless brakes
  08/11/20
great link; not one salary aside from the ceo's listed in th...
Glittery sanctuary
  08/11/20
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/119RI3oS9XNOjq2X8VLpU...
Wild irate ladyboy set
  08/11/20
is this a joke? I make more than a Senior Project Manager at...
Walnut crusty keepsake machete
  08/11/20
This is in Austin too. I didn't realize pay was relatively l...
cracking peach laser beams center
  08/11/20
I thought Blizzard was in Irvine
Walnut crusty keepsake machete
  08/11/20
nevermind, i see now that there's diff office locations on t...
Walnut crusty keepsake machete
  08/11/20
Why can't I fucking sort this piece of shit table? Whoever m...
autistic lime faggot firefighter candlestick maker
  08/11/20
They should be boosting the salaries a bit because the talen...
Erotic orchestra pit
  08/11/20
Serves them right for ruining WoW.
brass greedy antidepressant drug bbw
  08/11/20
...
French Range
  08/11/20
Lol.
cobalt balding legal warrant
  08/11/20
why do they think they're entitled to more pay? Japanese gam...
Up-to-no-good queen of the night becky
  08/11/20
(bobby kotick)
yapping lascivious business firm mexican
  08/11/20
(Kagemasa Kozuki)
tan mind-boggling cuckold
  08/11/20
...
cobalt balding legal warrant
  08/11/20
Pay raise for what? Do they even make games anymore? Whe...
aquamarine parlour
  08/11/20
Tbf, Diablo 4 is in production
cracking peach laser beams center
  08/11/20
Ugh... diablo is their worst. Just click click click click
aquamarine parlour
  08/11/20
WHAT, U DON'T HAVE PHONES?!?1
tan mind-boggling cuckold
  08/11/20
No, diablo 4 is a legit PC game
cracking peach laser beams center
  08/11/20
oh dang i was hoping they do more shitty mobile games dia...
tan mind-boggling cuckold
  08/11/20
35k to be a GM in Austin. Good or bad if you're just some r...
Lilac athletic conference site
  08/11/20
You can make more bartending on 6th street.
autistic lime faggot firefighter candlestick maker
  08/11/20
yeah but can u be fat and ugly and feel superior to other ne...
tan mind-boggling cuckold
  08/11/20
...
cobalt balding legal warrant
  08/11/20
whats a GM?
Yellow Generalized Bond
  08/11/20
game master, you basically handle customer support in game
ebony gaping chapel
  08/12/20
everyone knows gaming has the worst work-life balance and lo...
floppy primrose casino national security agency
  08/11/20
Bobby Kotick couldn't tell you how to reload in Warzone, but...
sepia dysfunction mad cow disease
  08/11/20
imagine if games studios could attract the talent that goes ...
Walnut crusty keepsake machete
  08/11/20
It's because videogames are art.
Yellow Generalized Bond
  08/11/20
...
Copper blood rage
  08/11/20
...
Erotic orchestra pit
  08/12/20
Because you can already "dominate the gaming industry&q...
sepia dysfunction mad cow disease
  08/11/20
that was my point though, if you get the talent and pay them...
Walnut crusty keepsake machete
  08/11/20
Okay, you risk billions on "something truly unique and ...
sepia dysfunction mad cow disease
  08/11/20
Apple didn't get where they are by aping the competition, at...
Walnut crusty keepsake machete
  08/11/20
Gaming is hits driven and it’s hard if not impossible ...
Swashbuckling wine coffee pot cumskin
  08/12/20
Nerds: video games::alpha law students:DA offices::young shr...
Snowy Abusive Crotch
  08/11/20
how has this model of giving millions to CEOs and scraps to ...
hideous harsh locus fortuitous meteor
  08/11/20
"For the quarter ended June 30, 2020, Activision Blizza...
sepia dysfunction mad cow disease
  08/11/20
seems like they cash hoard more than Amazon The CEO of ev...
hideous harsh locus fortuitous meteor
  08/11/20
CEOs are STRATEGIC THINKERS aka merge and divest every few y...
Aqua abode boistinker
  08/12/20
I don't see what the problem is. The large "discrepanci...
histrionic overrated nursing home
  08/11/20
It's because video games are art.
Yellow Generalized Bond
  08/11/20
It's widely known in the industry that game companies pay ab...
vermilion free-loading university quadroon
  08/12/20
The Engineering involved in a video game seems more "re...
histrionic overrated nursing home
  08/12/20
lol u know jack shit about software engineering
tan mind-boggling cuckold
  08/12/20
I knew a game designer 15 years ago and he was pretty smart ...
Aqua abode boistinker
  08/12/20
again u know jack shit about software engineering i know ...
tan mind-boggling cuckold
  08/12/20
Thought this was about Dairy Queen.
Nubile filthpig space
  08/12/20


Poast new message in this thread



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:16 PM
Author: cracking peach laser beams center

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-08-03/blizzard-workers-share-salaries-in-revolt-over-wage-disparities

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739531)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:24 PM
Author: Jet tripping liquid oxygen feces

One employee wrote that they had to skip meals to pay rent and that they used the company’s free coffee as an appetite suppressant. Another said they would only eat oatmeal and bail on team lunches because they couldn’t afford to buy food at the company cafeteria.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739621)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:25 PM
Author: yapping lascivious business firm mexican

another scammed reddit for free pizza

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739630)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:27 PM
Author: Talented bistre den kitty



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739647)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:55 PM
Author: Sticky sex offender mental disorder



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740016)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:25 PM
Author: cracking peach laser beams center

Sounds like they have lavish lifestyles

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739633)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:39 PM
Author: cordovan ticket booth organic girlfriend

*TMF adding cost of shitty free coffee to their total HHI* *frowns when he realizes they make more than him*

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739836)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:44 PM
Author: Walnut crusty keepsake machete

lol you beat me to the "all in" joke

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739890)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:54 PM
Author: scarlet shrine headpube



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740007)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 11:43 PM
Author: excitant multi-billionaire



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40742214)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:30 PM
Author: Curious principal's office karate

I been following this story (i'm a big MMO-mo though I don't play WoW) and they all posted their salaries and it honestly didn't seem that bad to me. There's definitely some shittiness with Blizzard offering perks like in-game membership time in lieu of actual bonuses though, that part is kind of funny. Reminds me of the old song 16 Tons.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739707)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:24 PM
Author: Zombie-like useless brakes

Lmfao at in game membership time being an employment perk jfc

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740276)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 6:20 PM
Author: Curious principal's office karate

One guy posted that he has 25 years of WoW subscription. That's kind of hilarious tbh.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740597)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 7:56 PM
Author: Zombie-like useless brakes



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40741063)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:31 PM
Author: Glittery sanctuary

great link; not one salary aside from the ceo's listed in the "entire" article.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739715)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:32 PM
Author: Wild irate ladyboy set

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/119RI3oS9XNOjq2X8VLpUOMpyarcMsNzid-nA1OqbXkA/htmlview?pru=AAABc9xm048*IoWzMOeJOOiSRFAKtwbe_g

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739738)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:35 PM
Author: Walnut crusty keepsake machete

is this a joke? I make more than a Senior Project Manager at Blizzard and I'm only a lowly engineer at a startup.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739789)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:36 PM
Author: cracking peach laser beams center

This is in Austin too. I didn't realize pay was relatively low there

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739800)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:38 PM
Author: Walnut crusty keepsake machete

I thought Blizzard was in Irvine

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739827)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:40 PM
Author: Walnut crusty keepsake machete

nevermind, i see now that there's diff office locations on the sheet.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739848)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:03 PM
Author: autistic lime faggot firefighter candlestick maker

Why can't I fucking sort this piece of shit table? Whoever made this deserves to be fired for failing at basic excel skills. I was making pivot tables in 8th fucking grade.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740095)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:33 PM
Author: Erotic orchestra pit

They should be boosting the salaries a bit because the talent leaving is a big issue - they should embrace the tech company catered free food thing IMO.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739756)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:37 PM
Author: brass greedy antidepressant drug bbw

Serves them right for ruining WoW.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739805)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:43 PM
Author: French Range



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739875)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 6:01 PM
Author: cobalt balding legal warrant

Lol.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740483)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:39 PM
Author: Up-to-no-good queen of the night becky

why do they think they're entitled to more pay? Japanese game developers don't get paid a whole lot of money and they make better games on average than Blizzard. this just seems like a lot of entitled BS to me.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739838)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:45 PM
Author: yapping lascivious business firm mexican

(bobby kotick)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40739899)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:53 PM
Author: tan mind-boggling cuckold

(Kagemasa Kozuki)

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740003)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 6:01 PM
Author: cobalt balding legal warrant



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740488)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:56 PM
Author: aquamarine parlour

Pay raise for what? Do they even make games anymore?

Where’s Starcraft Ghost? Warcraft 4? Starcraft 3?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740023)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:56 PM
Author: cracking peach laser beams center

Tbf, Diablo 4 is in production

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740028)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 4:57 PM
Author: aquamarine parlour

Ugh... diablo is their worst. Just click click click click

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740033)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:00 PM
Author: tan mind-boggling cuckold

WHAT, U DON'T HAVE PHONES?!?1

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740064)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:06 PM
Author: cracking peach laser beams center

No, diablo 4 is a legit PC game

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740118)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:08 PM
Author: tan mind-boggling cuckold

oh dang i was hoping they do more shitty mobile games

diablo franchise died with diablo 3.

they should make a warcraft 4 RTS game. or fix hearthstone.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740134)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:04 PM
Author: Lilac athletic conference site

35k to be a GM in Austin. Good or bad if you're just some random high school grad?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740104)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:06 PM
Author: autistic lime faggot firefighter candlestick maker

You can make more bartending on 6th street.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740125)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:09 PM
Author: tan mind-boggling cuckold

yeah but can u be fat and ugly and feel superior to other nerds in a virtual world on 6th street?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740142)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 6:01 PM
Author: cobalt balding legal warrant



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740489)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:23 PM
Author: Yellow Generalized Bond

whats a GM?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740260)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 12:12 AM
Author: ebony gaping chapel

game master, you basically handle customer support in game

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40742354)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:11 PM
Author: floppy primrose casino national security agency

everyone knows gaming has the worst work-life balance and lowest pay per hour in the software industry. the execs take advantage of loser nerds who aren't willing to stand up for themselves by forcing long hours, ridiculously tight deadlines, and low pay on them.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740162)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:13 PM
Author: sepia dysfunction mad cow disease

Bobby Kotick couldn't tell you how to reload in Warzone, but he can tell you how to fire hundreds of employees after a year that saw record profits. That's why he makes $40M and the monkeys churning out the microtransactions live off break room coffee.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740169)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:21 PM
Author: Walnut crusty keepsake machete

imagine if games studios could attract the talent that goes to Amazon, Google, Apple, etc. I don't know why they haven't tried to do this and dominate the gaming industry.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740238)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:24 PM
Author: Yellow Generalized Bond

It's because videogames are art.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740274)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:25 PM
Author: Copper blood rage



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740278)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 12:36 AM
Author: Erotic orchestra pit



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40742424)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:40 PM
Author: sepia dysfunction mad cow disease

Because you can already "dominate the gaming industry" paying poverty-level wages to nerds who will grind themselves to death for the privilege of making your product?

Most games being made today are lowest-common-denominator slop stuffed to the gills with microtransactions. You don't need Google engineers making $300k to churn out a Warzone battle pass every 60 days or update the roster in the next FIFA game.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740368)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:43 PM
Author: Walnut crusty keepsake machete

that was my point though, if you get the talent and pay them well maybe they can make something truly unique and forward-thinking and make you obscene amounts of ca$h

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740387)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:48 PM
Author: sepia dysfunction mad cow disease

Okay, you risk billions on "something truly unique and forward thinking." Meanwhile, Activision will print billions selling digital hats and gun skins to the mass market of retards willing to buy them.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740411)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:51 PM
Author: Walnut crusty keepsake machete

Apple didn't get where they are by aping the competition, at least not directly. it's a risk, yeah, just surprised no one has pounced on it yet. it's not like there's a shortage of money in the games industry.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740436)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 12:34 PM
Author: Swashbuckling wine coffee pot cumskin

Gaming is hits driven and it’s hard if not impossible to algorithmically determine what’s is a hit (look at Netflix). cos like google succeed from being really good at math and tech, they are autists who don’t have what it takes to make engaging content

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40744384)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 6:26 PM
Author: Snowy Abusive Crotch

Nerds: video games::alpha law students:DA offices::young shrews:PR

Jobs that are desirable type work to certain people so they can get away with paying absolute shit.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740630)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:41 PM
Author: hideous harsh locus fortuitous meteor

how has this model of giving millions to CEOs and scraps to employees been sustainable?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740376)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:44 PM
Author: sepia dysfunction mad cow disease

"For the quarter ended June 30, 2020, Activision Blizzard’s net revenues presented in accordance with GAAP were $1.93 billion, as compared with $1.40 billion for the second quarter of 2019. GAAP net revenues from digital channels were $1.59 billion, as compared with $1.09 billion for the second quarter of 2019. GAAP operating margin was 39%."

https://investor.activision.com/news-releases/news-release-details/activision-blizzard-announces-record-second-quarter-2020

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740395)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 5:46 PM
Author: hideous harsh locus fortuitous meteor

seems like they cash hoard more than Amazon

The CEO of every corporation is essentially a slush fund golem socking away wealth for the future

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740405)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 12:44 PM
Author: Aqua abode boistinker

CEOs are STRATEGIC THINKERS aka merge and divest every few years to take advantage of synergies or focus on core competencies

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40744483)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 6:20 PM
Author: histrionic overrated nursing home

I don't see what the problem is. The large "discrepancies" I am seeing are between Engineers making ~$150k and Losers averaging like $46,600. The moral of the story is to have a Clique, e.g. to be a Nerd and Engineer things. The Losers on the staff probably grew up playing video games passively like idiots whereas the Nerds were coding games in BASIC at age 7.

Sure, some of the Engineers make $110k and some make $160k but for all I know the latter is experienced in coding WoW expansions and the former is a n00b or Peter from office space.

Also a 10% average raise would just average out to 20% for Nerds and 0% for Losers.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40740598)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 11th, 2020 7:51 PM
Author: Yellow Generalized Bond

It's because video games are art.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40741035)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 12:01 AM
Author: vermilion free-loading university quadroon

It's widely known in the industry that game companies pay absolute shit. Go work for a real tech company if you want to make any money.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40742323)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 10:34 AM
Author: histrionic overrated nursing home

The Engineering involved in a video game seems more "real" than NFLX or a shitty website like AMZN or facebook. Physics and Game Engines and shit.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40743690)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 12:26 PM
Author: tan mind-boggling cuckold

lol u know jack shit about software engineering

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40744320)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 12:45 PM
Author: Aqua abode boistinker

I knew a game designer 15 years ago and he was pretty smart and took a lot of grad-level comp sci and math

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40744498)



Reply Favorite

Date: August 12th, 2020 12:52 PM
Author: tan mind-boggling cuckold

again u know jack shit about software engineering

i know a smart PHD quant friend working at lowe's. doesn't mean they need to boost lowe's salaries to google/netflix levels.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40744540)



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Date: August 12th, 2020 11:19 AM
Author: Nubile filthpig space

Thought this was about Dairy Queen.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=4601694&forum_id=2#40743930)