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How large of a portfolio is needed to spend $200k annually indefinitely?

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Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
10mm
Bearded den water buffalo
  07/07/25
fuck my ass.
carmine yapping gunner church
  07/07/25
This seems about right. $10 million yields $300k pretax annu...
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
There is no 3% rule. No one needs to be that conservative. ...
Lascivious bawdyhouse persian
  07/07/25
its not even that conservative dude. inflation, fees, fines,...
Bearded den water buffalo
  07/07/25
To my mind, 3% is aggressive going forward and a 2.5% or eve...
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
3% cagr means you could live 45 years with $5M on $200K spen...
razzle-dazzle house nowag
  07/07/25
you are retarded if you pay an effective tax rate of 33% on ...
racy fuchsia mental disorder
  07/07/25
Paying taxes is the law
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
Even if you are single, do no tax planning and have no deduc...
racy fuchsia mental disorder
  07/08/25
You're forgetting state taxes 😵‍💫
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/08/25
$6m
floppy clear blood rage kitty cat
  07/07/25
$200k is this supposed to be some kind of a trick question
Contagious potus
  07/07/25
...
White Garrison
  07/07/25
...
Copper nursing home
  07/07/25
...
federal drunken mother
  07/07/25
Between $4m-$5m depending on how conservative/aggressive you...
Lascivious bawdyhouse persian
  07/07/25
I said spend, so obviously I meant post-tax
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
Between $5.3m - $7.5m depending on various assumptions and d...
Lascivious bawdyhouse persian
  07/07/25
what the fuck are you buying every year?
chartreuse vigorous orchestra pit
  07/07/25
I dunno. Might enjoy having a place to live, food to eat, c...
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
you can do that for far less even in blue states.
chartreuse vigorous orchestra pit
  07/07/25
Think of it this way. Hedge funds typically charge 2 and 20...
Jet depressive
  07/07/25
answers like this always amaze me on xo. basic percentages b...
Bearded den water buffalo
  07/07/25
This makes no sense. OP, don’t think about it this way...
maize lay philosopher-king
  07/07/25
And yet, the answer it gives (between 5 and 7 million) is th...
Jet depressive
  07/07/25
Lmao
Mint fanboi telephone
  07/07/25
you probably literally only need $4m for that. Assuming you...
chartreuse vigorous orchestra pit
  07/07/25
I'll probably have $10 million or thereabouts when I hit The...
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
the reality though is that you should actually spend the 200...
Bearded den water buffalo
  07/07/25
You wanna try that again
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
he clearly meant "shouldn't"
chartreuse vigorous orchestra pit
  07/07/25
Depends, how much of the principal do you want to leave behi...
sapphire voyeur
  07/07/25
Leave behind for what
Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca
  07/07/25
whatever you want my friend. kids, family, charity, etc.
sapphire voyeur
  07/07/25
fuck jews
federal drunken mother
  07/07/25
"Leaving behind" makes almost no sense unless you'...
Lascivious bawdyhouse persian
  07/07/25
why is everyone assuming ~1/3 in taxes? that’s a high ...
carmine yapping gunner church
  07/07/25
generally retirement income from QPs is ordinary income.
sapphire voyeur
  07/07/25
withdrawals from 401(k)s and the like, yes. but i don’...
carmine yapping gunner church
  07/07/25


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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:03 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079518)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:04 PM
Author: Bearded den water buffalo

10mm

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079524)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:09 PM
Author: carmine yapping gunner church

fuck my ass.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079549)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:10 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

This seems about right. $10 million yields $300k pretax annually under the 3% rule, and assume 1/3 tax rate

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079556)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:10 PM
Author: Lascivious bawdyhouse persian

There is no 3% rule. No one needs to be that conservative. There is no version of the Trinity Study which supports this.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079558)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:12 PM
Author: Bearded den water buffalo

its not even that conservative dude. inflation, fees, fines, taxes, etc gobble up all of your supposed "earnings". the economy isnt really growing faster than that.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079572)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:15 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

To my mind, 3% is aggressive going forward and a 2.5% or even 2% rule is probably more appropriate

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079584)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:07 PM
Author: razzle-dazzle house nowag

3% cagr means you could live 45 years with $5M on $200K spend and not run out of $. If you can get 5% then you can do $4.2M and never have your balance drop.

edit: factor 2% inflation to the $200K spend - you'd run out of $ in 45 years with $5M

edit v2: I guess if you pay 25% taxes you'd run out of $ in 30 years vs. 44 and change, assuming you pay taxes on the $ you withdraw/spend

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079801)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 5:30 PM
Author: racy fuchsia mental disorder

you are retarded if you pay an effective tax rate of 33% on 300k in investment income.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49080104)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 6:20 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

Paying taxes is the law

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49080286)



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Date: July 8th, 2025 6:02 AM
Author: racy fuchsia mental disorder

Even if you are single, do no tax planning and have no deductions whatsoever, and every penny of income is STCG or dividends, the effective tax rate is still less than 25%. Additional medicare tax and NIIT pushes it to a bit over 26%. Even in the basic worst case scenario you don't pay 33%.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49081696)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 8th, 2025 11:01 AM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

You're forgetting state taxes 😵‍💫

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49082266)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 7th, 2025 3:07 PM
Author: floppy clear blood rage kitty cat

$6m

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079539)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:08 PM
Author: Contagious potus

$200k is this supposed to be some kind of a trick question

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079545)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:11 PM
Author: White Garrison



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079562)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:44 PM
Author: Copper nursing home



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079697)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:39 PM
Author: federal drunken mother



(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079950)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:11 PM
Author: Lascivious bawdyhouse persian

Between $4m-$5m depending on how conservative/aggressive you want to be. That's to get $200k pre-tax (increasing annually for inflation); you'd need to adjust upward if you want a post-tax figure.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079563)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 7th, 2025 3:15 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

I said spend, so obviously I meant post-tax

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079588)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 7th, 2025 3:27 PM
Author: Lascivious bawdyhouse persian

Between $5.3m - $7.5m depending on various assumptions and desired level of conservatism.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079633)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:53 PM
Author: chartreuse vigorous orchestra pit

what the fuck are you buying every year?

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079741)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 7th, 2025 3:58 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

I dunno. Might enjoy having a place to live, food to eat, clothes to wear, and so on.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079756)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 5:14 PM
Author: chartreuse vigorous orchestra pit

you can do that for far less even in blue states.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49080051)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:36 PM
Author: Jet depressive

Think of it this way. Hedge funds typically charge 2 and 20 (2% management fee on the principal, plus 20% of that year's return as a performance fee). So think of yourself as the manager of your personal "fund".

If you assume you're getting an 5% rate of return on your invested capital on average (pretty conservative), then you'd need $6,666,667. This would give a management fee of $133,333 plus a performance fee of $66,667 (6,666,667 * .05 * .20), which adds up to $200k. If you assume a 10% rate of return (maybe too aggressive) then you'd only need $5 million.

I am ignoring taxes here, you'd need a higher amount if you want $200k post tax.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079668)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:41 PM
Author: Bearded den water buffalo

answers like this always amaze me on xo. basic percentages but no reference to the fact that a guy who has 6.7mm in 2025 america shouldnt be thinking about "hedge funds" at all.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079685)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:50 PM
Author: maize lay philosopher-king

This makes no sense. OP, don’t think about it this way.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079724)



Reply Favorite

Date: July 7th, 2025 4:27 PM
Author: Jet depressive

And yet, the answer it gives (between 5 and 7 million) is the same as everyone else is saying. It's a reasonable rule of thumb that still lets the principal grow.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079896)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:59 PM
Author: Mint fanboi telephone

Lmao

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079760)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:52 PM
Author: chartreuse vigorous orchestra pit

you probably literally only need $4m for that. Assuming you are reasonable with it. e.g., take out less during down market years, take out more when the market is up/stable.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079738)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:56 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

I'll probably have $10 million or thereabouts when I hit The Wall in a couple years

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079751)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 3:59 PM
Author: Bearded den water buffalo

the reality though is that you should actually spend the 200k or even 100k unless youre puting a kid through college or something.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079762)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:01 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

You wanna try that again

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079775)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 5:15 PM
Author: chartreuse vigorous orchestra pit

he clearly meant "shouldn't"

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49080054)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:00 PM
Author: sapphire voyeur

Depends, how much of the principal do you want to leave behind? Assuming all or most of it, and a 4-6% withdrawal rate and 35% estimated taxes you'd need between 5-7.5m.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079773)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:02 PM
Author: Diverse Tantric Stead Macaca

Leave behind for what

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079779)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:02 PM
Author: sapphire voyeur

whatever you want my friend. kids, family, charity, etc.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079783)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:39 PM
Author: federal drunken mother

fuck jews

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079946)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 5:36 PM
Author: Lascivious bawdyhouse persian

"Leaving behind" makes almost no sense unless you're talking truly generational wealth, which the OP isn't. It's another shit boomer concept, i.e., it's cool to be shitty egoists all your life because you'll leave son Johnny and daughter Lisa $4.1m when you die at 93 which will somehow absolve your sins.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49080120)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:22 PM
Author: carmine yapping gunner church

why is everyone assuming ~1/3 in taxes? that’s a high blended rate for that level of income in the first place, and i wouldn’t think it would be too hard to structure most of the income as LTCG. this admittedly leaves aside the issue of taxes remaining close their current rates indefinitely.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079865)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 4:46 PM
Author: sapphire voyeur

generally retirement income from QPs is ordinary income.

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49079978)



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Date: July 7th, 2025 8:34 PM
Author: carmine yapping gunner church

withdrawals from 401(k)s and the like, yes. but i don’t think someone with $5-10M in cash/stocks/bonds has most of that in a 401(k).

(http://www.autoadmit.com/thread.php?thread_id=5747172&forum_id=2Reputation#49080738)